📅 Published on: 2024-12-11 18:05:16

⏱ Duration: 02:08:42 (7722 seconds)

👀 Views: 12666 | 👍 Likes: 416

📝 Video Description:

The Cleveland Guardians made their first major offseason move on Tuesday, sending Andres Gimenez to the Toronto Blue Jays in part of a 3-team trade.

In return, the Guardians received Nick Mitchell and Spencer Horowitz. Cleveland then shipped Horowitz to the Pittsburgh Pirates for Luis Ortiz and two left handed minor leaguers.

Are you a fan of the move?

The Miami Heat are willing to listen to trade offers for Jimmy Butler. Would you break up the Core 4 if it meant you could acquire the All-NBA forward?

Greg Newsome is headed to the IR with a hamstring injury. He’ll miss the rest of 2024. Has he played his last snap as a Brown?

Plus, we’ll recap Hard Knocks EP2 with Leroy Hoard and Shaun King.

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🕵️‍♂️ Transcript:

[Music] 3 [Music] he [Music] [Music] [Music] oh [Music] [Music] [Music] [Music] [Music] [Music] [Music] down [Music] [Music] [Music] Jay Crawford Adam the bull Garrett Bush Dustin Fox Jason Lloyd tyus Powell plus da da da you’re loving Mikey McNuggets and so many big names it would take me hours to say all of their names the ultimate Cleveland sports show starts now booah welcome everybody to a Wednesday edition of the ultimate Cleveland sports show along with G Bush and Jason Lloyd we made a big trade of uh of hosts we moved Jason into Wednesday we moved Dustin into Thursday hey look big trade going on this J Jason got the Japanese anime bang hanging down look like Japanese you out here looking like Future Trunks speaking speaking of Trades it’s been a hectic morning speaking of Trades and speaking of hair one of the shocking stories on today’s ultimate Cleveland sports show is jamus Winston lets a white guy cut his hair this is the most shocking news of the day we’ll get to that later Cavs trade rumors later Leroy horde later sha King will he defend jamus Winston off that awful performance come on we’ll find out we’ve got Mikey Anthony and Steve on the oh do we have Anthony I haven’t seen him he’s working from home today his uh his body felt sore EX for Christmas we’re going to buy an all right he’s breaking down 27 yeah and and we’re moving this this weekend that’s right his apartment and he’s already two days out on the iil with the sword Mike Anthony are are like still of the age where you help your friends move you know what I mean like I’m long past that heyen way past that I told I told my mom yeah all all our major projects done in the house were done by division one college lineman yeah after I had after I had my last surgery I told her I I I walked up to her shook her hand I said I’m I’ve retired yeah that’s it it’s done this is how I help friend move now hey moving company yeah yeah two two men this this segment is sponsored by two men I found I found a movie company that even Pats your stuff oh yeah it’s outrageously expensive it is but it’s worth every dollar wow for me it is but we got a huge Guardians news they make two trades it’s really a three- team trade but technically it’s two separate trades we’ll get into that first but first we talk to Mikey MCM yeah it was a great transition moving Anthony to moving players and that’s where we are starting today you can tackle all your NFL action with FanDuel America’s number one Sportsbook it’s not just football though you can also bet on Major League Baseball the NBA NHL anything you want to bet on you can find it on fans duing right now new customers can bet $5 and get $150 in bonus bets if that first $5 bet wins the FanDuel Sportsbook app gives you everything you need to place live bets on the NFL all in one place so when you get a hunch in the middle of the game you can check out the latest stats you live play byplay and so much more on the same page where you place your bets just visit fanduel.com ucss to join today never waste a hunch make every moment more with FanDuel an official Sportsbook partner of the NFL um so last night I don’t know when the news first broke of the first trade maybe between six and seven something like okay yeah uh the Guardians made a what I thought was a shocking deal I I’ve been saying for a little time that Andre SZ contract for the Guardians is not going to age well but so then why is this shocking it was shocking because I wasn’t expecting him to be traded I there have been no rumors about this whatsoever I’m not but let’s get into the details of the trade then into it so there you go so the Guardians made this trade they’ve acquired Spencer Horwitz and outfielder Nick Mitchell from the Toronto Blue J in exchange for Andre Jimenez couple hours later I had already gone to bed so I didn’t see it till the morning the guardi and there had been a rumor I think Ken Rosenthal had put out that he’ heard that Horwitz might only be with the Guardians for a minute and that’s exactly what happened the Guardians then sent Horwitz uh to the pirates for Luis Ortiz Luis l Ortiz because it’s to Luis Ortiz as a major league baseball he is a major league starting pitcher transitioned to the bullpen or to the a last year and then two uh young minor Leaguers Josh hardle and Michael Kennedy uh from the Pirates so there you go so those are the two trades uh obviously I got a lot to say about it but let’s start with you Jason what what what what do you think about the it’s really one trade to me one three- team trade yeah I think Jeff Pon blew their spot up early uh yesterday I think that’s why it came out the way that it did I think this because the first part of it was a bit of a head scratcher yeah I just I just the way that that came it it was long and and just how choppy it was I think that that got out faster than they were expecting it to which is why it turned out the way they did but anyway I’m not at all surprised I told you guys in October what if it’s am menz is the one that goes because of the contract and because he hasn’t lived up to it from an offensive standpoint yeah and obviously you saw roio starting to figure things out a little bit in the in the postseason hopefully that continues because he’s the short stop now going forward I think we all assumed bazano was going to be the second baseman they would move Jimenez to short and RI would be up out of here that is not the case Roi was going to be the short stop now and now you fill second base until bazan is ready you presume at this point bazan will be the everyday second baseman at some point here in the future so they were getting off the Jimenez money before that contract aged poorly that’s why I’m I’m not surprised at all uh I I hated the Horowitz return I I I don’t like Spencer Horowitz I didn’t understand that part he’s a first baseman with no power he show a little power to this point he walks a lot okay great they’ve got 100 other guys in the system like that he’s 27 and I thought man that’s the best you can do and so I like what they ended up getting for it better than than the horrorwitz piece I don’t understand what Pittsburgh’s doing like I totally get what Toronto’s doing they got a great glove first player who can’t has shown an ability to hit he’s falling off last couple years I totally get it from Toronto standpoint I get Cleveland’s endpoint I don’t know why Pittsburgh would give up even a number three starter for Spencer Horwitz but I I guess maybe there’s a gem in there that I don’t see yeah Luis Ortiz is the piece everybody’s going to talk about right now because he’ll be I would imagine he’s going to be in the opening day rotation at this point I think hardle could wind up being the piece down the road that winds up being the best piece in this only because Hardo looks like exactly what the guardian’s like he’s a soft tossing command guy doesn’t have a lot of Elo but he’s got good command there you see his numbers from his junior year at wake they’re atrocious he was phenomenal as a sophomore and because he got hit hard his junior year he went from a he dropped from a first round pick to a third round pick the Guardians will get him in their lab they’ll feed him horse testicles and whatever else that they do they’ll add three or four miles an hour to his fast ball I think he sits like 92 now it wouldn’t shock me at all if he’s 96 by the time he makes it to the majors presuming that he does he’s essentially not pitched in the minor yet he pitched an inning in two3 in a ball you’re you’re talking AB ball an a ball yeah he no he’s not going to be he’s not he’s not really an AB ball guy he’s a college pitcher right but he won’t be in the big leag for a minimum of two seasons maybe three this is why I love it this is why I love coming up here and getting some of this work he’s an a ball he’s he’s an a ball guy but he was just drafted last year it’s like bizan Bano is an aball he’s not an aball player man it is at least two years before he’s in the M I don’t know that it is he a junior at Wake Forest I know that but he struggled his last year in college he’s got a lot to he’s you’re probably not going to see him this year you’re probably not going to see him this year I’ll be best case scenario late 26 I think so oh I think earlier than that you can see earlier than we’ll see depends how he progresses and terms of Ortiz uh he’s a guy who he’s a middle to backend rotation guy which they need at this point they need somebody who’s going to eat Innings and get them through games yeah he dropped his change up picked up a cutter last year changed dropped his arm slot about nine degrees I think which is that’s a significant drop and by dropping his arm slot uh it changed the shape of his slider so he’s very much a work in progress again they’ll get him in the lab they’ll change his pitch pitch mix I would imagine maybe tweak his arm spot his arm slot again but just the fact that he he changed quite drastically as a pitcher last year and there’s a lot of Team control there with him and we’ll see what they’ve got right now I think at best he’s a mid- rotation guy a mid to bottom end rotation guy 345 starter and that’s something they need all right G let the Guardians have it you’re angry right now goad a middle so you made all these gymnastics for a middle to lowend starter uh I could Logan Allen is a middle to no starter uh McKenzie is the middle to low-end starter you got a bunch of those guys right now from from my perspective I look at it sheerly strictly the Guardians are Masters at this they are look I they they should be making the most money the front office should be making the most money in the history of the game because when the ownership tells them all right guys this a salary dump you figure out how to sell it they do a mass masterful job of moving around you you see all the moving parts of that halfway through it we got confused as to what what was even actually going on and who they got and then this morning you woke up and was like uh maybe it’s the Guardians they do a good job of keeping people you know maybe these trades are look turn out to be okay so what I put in the chat was so you meaning to tell me um we didn’t get we we we didn’t get nothing for Lindor we we because we moved the guy who turned out to be something defensively well you got these guys now we’ll see what they end up so we traded so that’s the thing that I always get at yes they at this point they got pumbedita so here’s for for the Layman and for the for the basball baseball fan that casually watches the this comes off as okay which team gets worse after they go to the ALCS who who the Yankees have gotten worse okay but but but they obviously they got worse for a much better reason is that they weren’t going to pay a half of 3/4 of a billion dollars right the Guardians got worse because they wouldn’t play a couple Pennies on a dollar the himz contract was bad but think about it is that a bad contract for 90% of Major League Baseball uh Jason would say no I I would say I I still think it’s not a great contract I think it’s a bad contract for Cleveland I don’t think it’s a terrible contract for major basball it depends if he if his if he the last two years if that’s what he is as a hitter it’s a bad contract period but nobody gets paid that kind of money to just be a good defensive player I mean not in 2024 but look where these salaries are headed this for for me this is a cost cutting measure this is strictly business business this is a return on investment yeah you just signed Bieber right and we talked about dang how did the Guardians sign Bieber and he ain’t gonna be ready till August and they gave him a bag of money but you’re not paying him much more than you did last year he’s making about what he made last year all well let me let me jump what I’m saying what I’m saying is you you’ve decreased salary elsewhere to keep the salary where it’s at right now to this point to this point yeah and my my point is if himz or Lindor or whoever it is if you’re watching the Guardians and you have a good player at what point will you ever say that guy is going to get signed longterm for the Guardians when they it’ll never happen when they give back 25 to 33% of their market value which is what Jose Ramirez did that’s it that’s how you they’ll never get that deal again so if you like bazer and he’s good for three years he’s not signing if you like Lind he’s not signing you got Bobby and and and uh Williams gav Williams if one of them plays or both of them are are awesome one of them is not signing here now that’s completely Fair it’s completely frustrating if you’re a fan now I could counter that and say well despite that they’ve been the most successful franchise in terms of consistently winning in this town now ultimately they haven’t won the biggest prize the Cavs get the edge there but they’ve been a winning Organization for a while now doing that that doesn’t change the fact that it’s frustrating I was I was accused in the last 12 hours of being an apologist for the Guardians and a hater of the Guardians in the last 12 hours you’re probably both and think it both pick a side pick a fence yeah yeah right you going to apologize for him or you goingon to be a so here’s here’s what I would say there’s two parts to this trade one part is the money aspect of this we’ll get to that in a second in terms of the talent like on the Major League ER are the Guardians a better team today than they were yesterday no not in my opinion now I don’t think they’re significantly worse I don’t either because I don’t because the as much as others no has nothing to do with the front office uh the minor Leaguers are zeros until they do anything to the majors they’re zeros they obviously have potential for this year they’re complete zeros and neither one has any chance being in the majors this year so major league roster today versus yesterday I think the Guardians are slightly worse in the the long term who knows obviously these guys have potential we’ve seen plenty of guys with potential in the Guardians and other teams never pan out so I we don’t know what those guys are going to be they’re nice lottery tickets now what I’ll say about the money because I saw a lot of people Laing the Guardians for saving money on this trade I I’m not in the business of loading an ownership ownership for saving money the goal is to win not to save money the team that saves the most money doesn’t win the championship so if the Guardians while I don’t love Jimenez and I think people are overblowing his importance as a player because his defense is great but his offense has been outside of one year in the majors below average and he’s he’s not worthy of the money he’s getting in my opinion based on what he’s been as a player outside of one year but the I I’ll say what I’ve consistently said if they made this trade to be able to allocate money to other places whether that’s signing an extension with Quan or BBY or who knows or it means signing a free agent I’d like to sign glabber Torres yes there’s some outfielders that might be a better fit but I I think the Guardians have the ability I don’t know they probably won’t do it but why couldn’t they sign glabber Tores for two years and 18 million and they had an outfielder their payroll would still be under 140 million really going to take a 2E 18 million deal two no no 18 million per year oh I was going to say and even that would he I mean how old is he that’s what 30 27 oh he’s only 27 he’s coming off a bad year that was the projection at MLB trade rumors which I follow they’re very good I they are be surprised if he has to settle for a two-year deal listen I he’s not he’s a good player not a great player he’s marginal defensively but he’s got great power for a second base he does I don’t second base is not a high value position I don’t care about the value of the position I need power I need hitters give me an outfielder who can hit the ball out of the park and can I have an outfielder and have him for two years not on this team well we should be we should demand that you’re not going to have an $18 million second baseman and a20 million if it’s only two years what’s the big deal because of this year the payroll no and and the payroll has to go up from last year it’s not going to I’m telling you right now it’s not going to you’re going to move this you’re going to move this shell over here yeah and you’re going to fill that spot over there but but it’s it’s the December 11th so we got a lot of offseason to go when they get to opening day I don’t from what I was told I don’t think that the payroll is going to be drastically higher than what it was last year but here’s the thing you just took 10 million away from Jimenez if you move Josh Naylor you’ve just created a $20 million spot so you can fill that but but when you get to April the number is not going to be drastically higher than what it was last year it’s just it could look a lot different okay and there’s part of us that has to say okay they’re not going to spend the money so how good can they be under these constraints but there’s another part of me that’s like well I’m not get I’m going to I even though I know it’s not going to make a difference I’m not giving them a pass for not spending more I’m not giving them a pass I’m just saying like you can yell and scream all you want the reality is the payroll is going to be where it was last year very similar to it they they they’re very good at this they understand the vitrio that goes to the Browns they understand that people literally have this thing where they’re going to crucify F the Browns when they do something they play off that very well because we we take for granted that they don’t have the money they won’t sell the books we don’t know that for a fact they just say we’re not doing it oh they have the money they just won’t spend it so if you don’t spend the money and you tell us every single year that the payroll is going to be this and we look around the landscape what you’re telling us is the only way that we win a championship is if we get lucky or or you’re counting on the fact that it’s baseball they put that in this business model where if you make the playoffs you sell people hey anything can happen there Rangers a couple years ago but listen I mean it the the chances of that happening are below 10% if you’re not even close to competitive in payroll which is why which is why I believe baseball needs a cap because with a cap comes a floor and you can start you’re never going to catch the Yankees and the Dodgers never but you it’s it’s not impossible it’s very rare to win a World Series with where the Guardians payroll is it’s very very rare not impossible yes they have to get lucky that is true so but with the cap brings a floor and baseball is so stubborn and the players are so arrogant and they keep saying we’re the we have the strongest Union around and we will never agree to that and guess what you also have the worst relationship of any sport between the players and the owners there’s more distrust between the players and owners of baseball than any other Sport and I believe it’s because there’s no cap the billionaires in this country scream about capitalism all the time but they want socialism for their Sports and i’ i’ I’ve come I’ve sat in this chair a million times and said I’m as capitalist as they get get every dollar you can yeah and if I’m a player of course I want to get every dollar I can for the health and the betterment of the sport we’re having two different conversations I believe baseball needs a cap but but talking about a cap in baseball is really no different than me complaining about I agree Guardians not spending because neither one’s going to happen but with if with a cap comes a floor and then you have a minimum that you have to spend yeah but that supposedly happens in the NFL and it doesn’t really teams don’t well here’s the thing about NFL Green Bay and Kansas City can win a Super Bowl here’s the thing about the NBA Oklahoma City can win an NBA championship Cleveland did win an NB or NBA Championship in baseball Kansas City won a World Series they did so but that’s where I’m saying it’s not impossible it’s just rare the Guardians were one game away they were you know I mean it’s again it’s not impossible it’s rare how do you I’m so I’m thinking of about from a business standpoint in your customer base yeah how do you sell this to people how do you say Okay um I know that you know the athletes are going to drive the attendance right but we’re going to sell you overall success over a general 10-year period compared to people in our Mark you how you sell it g you know how you sell it in July when you’re in first place because they this team dreads the off season because they get pounded exactly what we’re doing today they get pounded from October to March every year and then they get back on the field and by God I don’t know how they did it but they’re back in contention again and it all goes away and then the offseason comes and we kill them again but they if they had better off Seasons they’d have better attendance this team has such a razor thin margin for error that they operate under it’s unbelievable they do what they do so what you’re saying is they’re not really trying to win no that’re I mean the all that that that you’re you’re saying we want to be hyper competitive we want to maximize profit but when it comes to actually legitimately going all in to try to win at the highest level yeah we’re not in it for that we’re in it for this to be fair that is true now I would argue based on that definition there’s really only four teams trying to win I agree I mean even even the Cubs who spend they’re not they don’t spend like the Yankees the Dodgers do they’re not trying to win the same way but you got to think it’s a difference between being super Frugal and being smart no I agree I agree sure the Cubs are trying to win more than the Guardians are trying to win they understand their restraints like at least they have room like for me think about if this was any other sport think about it if the if the Cavs or the Browns got to the AFC championship NBA uh or Easter Conference Finals and then they got rid of like one of their best players I know they’re not going to get there this year but we may see T Higgins walk out of Cincinnati and maybe see Jamar Chase which would be criminal well so it does happen once in a while in those sports but not in baseball happens all the time but the Guardians in the Bengals are twins when it comes to sports the Guardians are to the Bengals being cheap as the cheap they are they’re it’s always out the Bengals are not as well run as the guardians but they’re they’re decently run considering their owner cheap they they’re as they’re money conscious as as the guardi time yes now I look now I I’ll give them credit listen they come out two out of three times they come out with the the the winning winning these trades two out of three I give them that right but I will say this though their their track record of who to extend and who not to extend is not looking good zenino contract terrible well that wasn’t an extension but the money they they’re signing people to Bell contract was bad the the himz contract was bad M straw contract bad like they got some they got re’s contract is great it’s the only thing saving Jimenez is the is the perfect example why I believe this team has shown hesitancy they will not sign a guy before the first major get bat which is the new trend in baseball now these guys are signing before they’re first at bat because they’re agents have convinced players taking these pre-arbitration deals is bad business and you’re better off going year toe in arbitration getting to free agency after year six or seven and cashing in well we saw it with Soto and so yeah so now if you want to get these guys you have to get them prior to their first appearance in the majors and the Guardians have shown no inclination to do that or at least after their first year unless it’s a killer year I mean it’s getting to the point with a lot of these guys you have to sign them before their first that’s true but most of those guys even but even with Jimenez the point is even with Jimenez who had a great year and they felt like okay here’s a guy we can hitch our wagon to right and then he completely fell off a cliff offensively the last two years and now it’s it’s if he was a free agent this wi this win Anderson menz what’s he making 10 million next year he would make $10 million next year in the open market I wholeheartedly believe but he wouldn’t get a long-term deal but it’s the so it’s like they’re getting out in front of this now yeah because if you have to eat the money at the back end right now you have to take back like they got out of this before it got really really bad right but don’t you agree they should spend money to replace that of course so like they just they created $10 million and again if they if they move on from Josh naor I had somebody tell me that Naylor’s going to be traded so there’s another I can’t remember what he’s on the books for for next year but I think it’s around 10 yeah you just created $20 million okay now here’s here’s now Naylor is a if you trade Naylor that’s a whole different ball game because that’s a legitimate bat you have to like with Jimenez even if they end up using angel Martinez instead of Jimenez right you didn’t get any worse offensively right and when when have they been power you got you bet right now they already need one big bat if you trade na you need two I think they view I want to hear manzardo is one I’m telling you manzardo is a half of a replacement to Naylor that’s he gets you halfway there I think in addition to manzardo you need two bats if you trade Naylor well you you have to fill the DH slot and I just want to see an outfielder they have one outfielder and as far as I’m concerned you have one everyday outfielder they might trade L Thomas also and and by the way this just signified to me they’re not signing Quan you tell me this means they’re signing quanan Quan’s already to arbitration yeah again you’ve I I believe you’ve probably missed the Quan’s an interesting guy though cuz he’s the type of player doesn’t get a ton of money but he’s really smart and he knows his values singles hitters don’t get paid I I mean he’s a singles hitter and a gold Glover Benn by the way are you sure he’s a singles hitter yeah I mean he was hitting home runs at the beginning of the year yeah but he he’s never hitting 25 home runs if he gets to 15 If he if he can hit 300 with 15 home runs score 100 glove and left field gold glove that take it easy he’s not going to play he’s not going to make but I’m saying the come for him is Andrew Ben and tendi and that contract’s been a disaster for the white socks like that’s the kind of profile he has so you agree he’s not you agree I don’t think the Guardians going to I think there’s a chance because of the type of player he is they’ve tried with him what I mean he’s not what kind of big contract is he going to get what does he think he’s going to get he not getting 25 million they offered them I know they tried so yeah and they and they’re not I mean I was going to say they’re not locking list and by the way you mentioned BBY I don’t want him to sign BBY well I’m done generally starting contct ones I’m done McNuggets mckn am I crazy this listen am I am I just sitting here think they just told me the baseball guys told me they ain’t signing Quan Bobby not getting signed um Josh Naylor to be up out of here let me respond to that with a question that we’re going to bring in L we’ll get back to more Guardians with Sasaki at the end of the show but G to answer your question are you surprised well uh no your answer not at this point but I mean but I just feel like the like we we we’re we’re Guardians fans we’re little kids trading baseball cards we never get to Mickey Manel we trading we tradeing we get the guys that are in every pack yeah every pack yeah the the dick tiros of the world um that’s a good point you know one last thing real quick before Leroy I think sometimes when Jason and I get in the weeds in these conversations that’s when we’re having the conversations about they’re not going to sign Quan we’re taking out be at that point we’re just we’re having that conversation with the acknowledgement even though I don’t like it and you don’t Doo but you’re more accepting of it I guess that they’re not going to spend serious money we’re not like they should be extending certain guys I I’m with you on the pitching General extending in the 30s is a like this Max free deal with the Yankees it’s going to be an awful deal he’ll have a couple of really good years for them in the long term it’ll be a disaster if you sign a pitch to a 5year extension after his 30s more times than not these guys are going to have Tommy John sergy at some point now if I could lock up you just lost two of the five years right that’s true you just lost 40% contract St Quan’s a guy they should sign through abely 100% And they won’t because or they probably won’t I’d rather see him in field I think he should be the center fielder ab and put Power bats in in the corner spots we’re going to talk more Guardians with some Sasaki rumors later in the show let’s pivot to the Browns bring in Leroy after a quick word from built rewards listen up renters have you ever felt like you’re stuck in the loop of rent payments just watching your money vanish Into Thin Air it’s time to turn the rank game around and start earning some serious rewards that’s where built rewards come in built is breaking ground as the 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hurt last year like they’re a terribly run organiz ation they’ve been terrible for years and I’m like well at least we’re not Marlin’s fans but those fans have at least seen World Series Championships at Cleveland’s expense Cleveland wild I mean and it’s a horrible organization and it’s basically been horribly run I don’t know how much you talk in baseball down there Leroy but like they’ve been horribly run for for pretty much ever but and and you know so how many championships they got um two they they’ve done two they have two they’ve done something that a a lot of teams won’t like they basically bought two of them yeah yeah right and and the unfortunate thing about that is is that they don’t spend money um not all we had a conversation today was I can’t name a drafted prospect that ended up playing for the Marlins think about that yeah I’m thinking about it right now so all these other teams are playing all these other teams are playing drafting guys you know bringing their their young stars in to play you know and they have those four or five years you know where there’s arbitration or before they have to give them the big money the Marlins don’t have that nobody so it it it’s it it’s unfortunate it’s been a while since Charles Johnson was was catching what about Stanton was he a free agent signing when that when he got traded they traded Stanton no but I’m saying didn’t they draft they trade they trade every time a player gets good they trade him for Prospect I thought they drafted prospects work out they did yeah huh I thought they drafted him originally Stanton and dant TR Willis I mean we’re going back that’s they drafted Yelich they draft Yelich yeah as soon as they get good they soon as they get any good they get rid of them so you don’t as listen as a fan of a team yeah I don’t care what sport it is one of the things you enjoy is seeing your young Prospect grow up through your organization sure so you can call him that’s our guy right when you don’t have a team that you can do that the interest is sometimes lost because you know like baseball there’s so many guys you don’t know who the hell it is unless they tell you old top prospect from here we got him from here he’s coming up you don’t know yeah and so baseball is a hard sport to follow to get to that point to where okay this is our guy I mean last time they won a championship Pudge Rodriguez was the catcher yeah what was your favorite team growing up like I I get the frustration yeah what was your favorite team growing up by the way I didn’t have one oh you didn’t have one I didn’t have one baseball we didn’t have baseball in New Orleans no I know that we have baseball although I did grow up down the street from Will Clark oh really he’s a crazy dude that guy supposedly no comment Leroy hit him with the no comment no all right let’s let’s switch let’s switch it up Leroy Let’s uh obviously this past week was probably James’s worst performance since becoming the starter of the brown can I just say this about jamus yeah let let me let me know if you guys follow me I think I figured it out and okay here’s what it is jamus wants to play his style of football and that’s chucking it throwing it or whatever he’s not playing the game you understand what I’m saying like you know what sometimes um Josh Allen will be for 22 for 180 yards that’s what’s required to win so he’s not chucking the ball down the field he’s not taking big chances because the way the game is being played is dictating that when I watched jamus this past weekend it just seemed like he wanted to throw for 400 but 400 wasn’t going to be that that week that week was going to be if you look at the other side and look at what um what what um who’s the the quarterback for the Steelers Russell Wilson um Russell Wilson yeah sorry um it wasn’t that the numbers weren’t gudy he made some plays but he played the game that was in front of him like we get so caught up in the numbers of it we don’t get caught up in success you you see what I mean and so from that standpoint if I would have taken and and been 65% but only had 180 yards passing that might have helped the team more Leroy you see what I mean let me jump in real quick Leroy I said this to a Dy yesterday I said this this broke me with with jamus Winston because earlier in that game you looked at both both teams you looked at Russell Wilson Russell Wilson was struggling he was throwing the ball they even the boob Birds came out a little bit and I said oh this about to be one of them AFC North the first person to get to 165 one touchdown control the ball make sure but jamus instead of saying okay the screen ain’t there I I I’m double clutching it ain’t there let me throw the ball in the dirt and live the fight another day because I know as a game manager I know what the other side is going against and I understand the climate of the game let me get my let me at least get my team in a situation where we can play this type of football that is identifying What type of game you’re playing in right like I knew that there were games where our team as a whole was going to have 30 carries for 100 yards mhm and it’s the 30 carries that’s the most important part not the yards because the 30 carries means you run it and be effective and you were controll in the game even though the numbers weren’t there mhm sometimes you got to get some of your your your your best quarterbacks in the league tend to identify what type of game is going to be quicker and just play that game and win that game in front of them and not worry about the numbers I think sometimes jamus feels that he has to make a play and the most important thing is keeping the ball the most important thing is okay it’s not in this possession on this possession the worst thing based on how the game is played the worst thing is not to have to punt it and and and so he sometimes and and I would like him to do a better job of identifying What type of game he’s playing in to that point Leroy you mentioned Josh Allen earlier when you got started and it reminded me I just did a story in September in the athletic on the two high safeties in the NFL and the way that it’s changed how quarterbacks are attacking here’s what Josh said in this story we wrote in September it’s understanding that when I do take risks that they’re calculated and the reward is well worth it I haven’t thrown the ball too many times downfield and then here’s one more uh when we get into the Red Zone we’ll find more ways to get exotic and score because it’s a little harder down there but we’re not going to do anything to put the ball In Harm’s Way up until that point I think it just speaks right into what you were just talking about right it I it look we all have a game plan and and we all you know when you talk about what kind of game you going to play on Wednesday and Thursday it’s a whole lot different when you in that game on Sunday and the juices get flowing and you want to win and you want to make plays to win I think as a competitor the hardest thing in the world to do at times is throw the ball away you know if you think about it quarterbacks who have security can throw the ball away quarterbacks who are trying to make a name or trying to win a job or trying to get an extension throwing the ball away seems like failure and so I understand all of that but I would say for jamus he’s been around the game long enough to where he should be able to understand oh this what kind of game we’re going to be in this is one of them AFC North games right like you got to be able to identify what kind of game you know the difference in you know hey if it’s a shootout and they’ve scored the last three series then the checkdown probably won’t get it done I got to take some chances but if the other quarterback is 12 for 17 for 80 yards then you also got to know what type of game we in did you happen to see last night’s episode of hard KN just GNA ask about no I there was a it’s fine I’m gonna be honest with you no I appreciate I can because I can explain this in two seconds there was a snippet on the sideline of the Monday night game against Denver where they got Kevin on the headset saying hey we’re on Pace for 400 yards keep the ball in five’s hands like I don’t care if he’s under Center I don’t care if he’s shotgun keep the ball in five’s hands and that like if it sounds like that’s speaking to like there are games like that and I I’ll be honest I was a little bit surprised because I said last week uh Ken dorsy doesn’t know how to run the ball all he does is call pass plays that’s all he does that’s all he did in Buffalo that’s all he does here well here Kevin is encouraging him just keep it in five’s hands and let him rip it because that’s what the game was dictating and because jamus was piling up the yards and Kevin told him hey we got a 400 yard game here keep it in five’s hands no matter what you do keep let him throw it I I think we all maybe maybe even as coaches maybe everybody needs to get a better understanding of what type of game you’re playing in right yeah it it happens it happens to where you don’t quite by the time you figure out that you in a dog fight not a shootout you already made too many mistakes and now you got to bring a shootout to a dog fight and and that’s kind of what happened to the Browns this past week right that you had turnovers and penalties and mistakes to the point where now you’re trying to ketchup and a street brawl and now you’re putting yourself in even more trouble so I think it it you know it’s a as as a running back I could kind of get a better feel of it I kind of knew early on when whether I was creasing them or it was going to take time and we were going to have to be patient with it right but would guess that applies to everything like when when you see like you guys were talking about you see that too deep you know exactly what they’re saying we not giving up a deep play we not gonna let you throw for 400 against us okay you know they got a pass rush so guess what a lot of your stuff is going to be shorter so you got to find creative ways with to short pass that’s just the es and flows of game to game to game um but no matter what the game plan is it falls on the quarterback because he has the ball to understand what he’s experiencing on that field and I just wish and and when I watch the game I kept saying that to myself I kept saying James James James patience patience patience it it’s not gonna be there every time this is not last week it’s the Steelers got say the Steelers got on that tap was hey hey Bush last week’s price ain’t this week’s price show not and speaking every game is different go ahead yeah what I was gonna say Leroy is that speaking of which another thing from the hard KNX last night we’re going to talk more about it later there’s a clip of Mike Tomlin talking to the captain of the Steelers and which he says because the Steelers put up huge numbers offensively the week before too playing against Cincinnati Russell Wilson threw for over 400 yards and he said to the leaders he’s like I don’t want anybody looking at their stats or getting overhyped from their stats last week this could this is going to be a different game we that’s exactly what he said we just got to win the game look who cares about the stats he said they were going to take extra special care of the ball because of the pick sixes that they had right against Denver so Cleveland’s going to spend all week this week focusing in on turnovers that’s right it was fascinating yeah and it was true that’s that’s my point that’s my without without seeing any of that I’m telling you how you have to approach every week you know his Steelers weak the the Steelers are going to run the ball 40 times and pass it 15 times if they can you can’t it like you got to match that intensity you got to match you know kind of the and and so what if the game is 107 that’s right that’s Steelers week lero do you do you believe um I I think it’s getting a jamus a little bit uh because obviously everyone’s human right I I do you feel like jamus feels like hey I got an opportunity to kind of stick here or to rekindle my career and I understand that I got to overperform I to to make this thing work you think he might be pressing a little bit to to kind of prove that he he’s a guy yes yes and and that’s what I said earlier jamus a true leader wins the game that’s in front of him at the end of the day if you were two for 15 right you can still stand up on that Podium and said we did what we had to do to win cuz that’s the most important thing and and your team will understand and appreciate that I just think that sometimes we get caught up in winning a certain type of way and we forget that the main goal is winning you see one of the one of the and I remember last year uh JJ McCarthy threw eight passes I remember that game yeah right and and what they said after the game was it’s not about throwing for 300 it’s about winning and that that is always going to be true like what whatever sport you play right you watch basketball sometimes a team is beating you up in the paint right that don’t mean you start chucking up more threes they GNA to you to death you got to play their style of basketball it’s just like we’ve gotten so far away from winning and now we concentrate on numbers on analytics on whatever to the point where like do you understand that you’re competing do you understand that I don’t care what the analytics say you got to get a feel for what your team can do and how they’re competing every fourth and one ain’t the same fourth and one ain’t no good if you’ve been getting your ass kicked up front that’s true so for a coach say analytics say go for it you’ve been watching your team for 60 minutes you know damn well they can’t get fourth and one you see I have the the biggest problem I have in sports right now is what’s going on with the eagles they are 11 and two and they call them dysfunctional I’ll take that who’s calling disal now at this point I don’t know that anybody’s doing that you he Brown’s comments well then Brandon Graham came out on his own podcast he said that AJ Brown and Jaylen Herz aren’t friends anymore and there’s definitely a rift between the two well I mean that’s their fault that’s not the analytics people fault no but I’m just saying in in General because here first of all let’s let’s understand that nobody thinks Philadelphia’s going to go anywhere because of whatever reason right they only got the best Run game in in the league which if if jayen Herz don’t throw a pass that mean they got a chance of winning right the the fans been trying to get rid of the coach all year and now they 11 and two and nobody knows how to act yeah but it’s about winning it’s about in in and I think in all of sports yeah we’ve gotten away from the fact of I don’t care when the game right Michigan just won a game 13 to 10 you think they care no no they won a rivalry game win the game I don’t care how every game is not going to look pretty but at the end of the day you can go and sit in front of your locker take a deep breath and say got we got that one though Leroy let me that’s what it’s about yeah let me let’s wrap it up with this speaking of the Eagles saquan Barkley needs 483 yards to become the all-time single season rushing leader however if he does it he will have done it in 17 games as opposed to Eric Dickerson who did it in the 16 Game season uh will you count OJ Simpson do it in 12 he ran for 2012 or 14 I believe he did so will you count will is it fair that Barkley get or should it be based on average yards per game at the end of the season what do you think really really I’m asking you no he got the he got the record all right run it for for what is it 216 uh something like that yeah let me see I’ll give you number I’m a running back I think I I probably know that number 21105 21105 you missed by one yeah um OJ had 2003 yes in 1973 right and what they play 12 games or did they play 14 14 14 14 okay so like no no come man that’s that’s an NFL record nobody wait did we do anything about all the other records no right you’re right if somebody get to sa if somebody get to sack we gonna say oh he played an extra game we are not no you think Barkley’s going to do it he needs he needs 483 yards in four games what do you say here’s what I think I think if he is close they’ll go then you let him get it yeah yeah if he needs 150 plus going into the last week I think you rest him yeah I do um simply simply because you know I tell people I don’t know what they think football is but for a running back is a confrontational Sport and that means that you are susceptible to all kinds of hits on every play and it would suck you know that you try to get a record in the last game of the season that you don’t need and something happens so yeah yeah I I wouldn’t even no I wouldn’t even I wouldn’t even do it but I mean he’s been averaging over 100 games a week so say if he has a 200y if he go out there get 200 now now all right like he might get to that last game he only need like 60 yards yeah it’ be interesting thanks Leroy we’ll see you next week right us okay all right good talk with Leroy as always Sean King coming up in a little bit Mike what do you got got a quick read get back to baseball if you’re looking for a Guardians themed gift this holiday season the ice Shaker is the perfect gift for the Guardians fan in your life you’ve probably heard of it before and Ice Shaker is now an officially licensed product with the NFL NHL NBA NCAA and Major League Baseball it was created by and used by the gronowski brothers it sold over 1 million bottles they’ve changed the game with the workout bottles and this is the gift you’ve been looking for right now if you go to ice shaker.com and use promo code lockon NFL you can save 25% on your order at checkout it has a patented twist and agitator that breaks up powders but it’s silent when you shake it instead of that annoying ball metal sound Pet’s third party tested and holds ice for 30 hours and it makes for a great tailgating cup for mixed drinks as well order your team branded bottles today at ice shaker.com use promo code locked on NFL for 25% off your order ice shakers show your support for your teams with the best branded workout bottles on the market which is obviously the ice Shaker Bo you tweeted this yesterday and I wanted to bring this up but yeah Joe wolf who’s the agent for Roki Sasaki who we’ve talked about in the past yeah said that there’s a chance that Sasaki prefers a smaller Market with a smaller media pool which is more similar to how he was or how he’s been brought up in the Japanese baseball system yeah as opposed to being with the team on the west coast you mentioned and you’ve told us in the past that the money is not necessarily an issue because they can only use so much of their International pool money interation pool money nobody gets more than what 10 12 million in year yep I can’t remember the highest amount it it’s different per team but it’s the whatever the highest amount is it’s not too much for the Guardians so go ahead yeah so could the Guardians be a real player in the Sasaki sweep Stakes if he actually is open to going to a smaller Market yeah with a smaller media contingent Allah Cleveland like so I mentioned a month ago when there was first talk so Sasaki is considered like the next Elite Japanese player yeah okay and when elite players become free agents the Guardians are never in the conversation however this is a unique situation because Sasaki is not technically a free a traditional style free agent when um yo yoshinobu Yamamoto came over last year he signed a $300 million contract obviously the Guardians aren’t in the mix there because he was a free agent in Japan he was an older player Sasaki has not reached free agency in Japan so what happened is his team posted him which is a system where uh it allows the player to be a free agent in some manner but when he’s posted as a as opposed to being a typical free agent that money spent on that player comes out of every team’s International player pool and the international player pool is a very limited amount of money which means that nobody could pay more Sasaki more than like I can’t remember the exact amount but it’s at most $12 million might even be less per year now that’s in the realm for the Guardians when his a but you still a lot of times the Japanese players will go to big cities because there’s Japanese people in big cities especially on the west coast and the Northeast all right May lesser degree Chicago we don’t have a large Japanese population in Cleveland uh neither do a lot of the other small markets but when his agent suggest yeah he might be a little more comfortable at least initially in America in a small Market I mean Jason you know this better than anybody you’re not getting covered by the Guardians get covered by the Yankees or the Cubs or the Dodgers or the Mets it’s another ball another world and if he’s going to choose a small Market team you would think that the Guardians would be on the top of his list considering what they do with pitching I dismissed you a couple weeks ago and now you’re on board well I mean I would love to see him here I just didn’t think it was realistic right I I thought probably not also but once I heard this I thought it was yeah I mean of course you go after him sure I just didn’t think that there was any chance that they would actually come here but if he’s open to it absolutely would you trade Andre C menz for Roki Sasaki yes bro seconds listen can they just offer the max what’s the max I don’t I don’t know we you could probably look it up Mike every T now here’s the thing you got to be careful January 15th and he’s not going to sign until after January 15th or I don’t remember the exact date sometime in January that’s when the 2025 International pool money starts most teams have used most of their International pool money for 24 do you have the list of 2025 International pool money I do it doesn’t seem right but according to Baseball America yeah on January 15 2025 your pool opens up it runs till DEC mber 15th 2025 yeah it’s 7.55 million for the Guardians it’s the max that might be it that could be right I might be wrong if that could be right then that could be right I I was thinking 11 12 million but I I’m not sure I mean like that’s the one I don’t follow the international pool Money numbers like closely so if the most anybody could pay him is 7.55 million it’s a no-brainer I’m sure the Guardians have to be in the mix with saki If he if he’s interested in a small Market team spamming again he’s never played in the majors we we don’t know for sure but unlike when the Japanese players first started coming over years ago and it was a little more like most of the the high-profile Japanese players that have come over in recent years they’ve all hit listen do we have an example of a Japanese player that’s come over in recent years that hasn’t been good if if you come over after Otani I’m automatically assuming you’re good you’re great you’re automatically All-Star I’ll figure it out this guy is you know like he’s an Ace and he hits he’s an ace does he hit no he don’t hit I mean he might hit but he’s not going to going to be I’m going to try I’m going to try as a switch hitter listen and at left field but if they got in the mix for him then I like to be you know I would as everybody knows I was a little I’m not as excited about the Bieber move because I think they need another pitcher and I’m worried about where he’s going to be but if you somehow got Sasaki then I love the beber move because now he’s just an I mean cuz in theory I don’t mean to get people too excited but if you had Sasaki Bieber and BBY for the playoffs and Gavin Williams is Gavin Williams is your fourth starter Luis Ortiz hey hey Ortiz Hey listen I need y’all baseball y’all got all these baseball contacts y’all always texting all these people I need y’all to figure something out here I need y’all to spam these text messages and figure out this a thing yeah like they need this don’t don’t hype me up over here like oh we about to get this ball player I’m sure all 32 teams want them Jason I need you to hit you and all your athletic people send emails andm whatever the case may be cuz we need them we we now know there’s some invisible money you’ve been hiding this International money from people like us from the brothers the brothers didn’t know about no International money you know what I’m saying so now you’re out it you got we expecting you to spend from that from that little pot bro stop playing around we understand you now if you’re the if you’re him and you do and you’d be more comfortable going SW Market team wouldn’t the Guardians just from a baseball stand be top of the list you know Tampa maybe whatever but like if winning is important to you yeah and you want a small Market team right Tampa Cleveland Kansas City yeah but I would think Cleveland would be number one and Tampa’s got to play A Minor League Stadium this year I don’t know you want to do that if you’re him uh all right that’s it for the baseball for today good stuff let’s get back to the with sha King he’s going to join us next and then we’re going to get to some Cavs after Sean more trade talk with the c trade talk we’re going to bring sha King in after a quick word from FanDuel who is sponsoring our interview today with the former NFL quarterback himself you can tackle all your NFL action with FanDuel America’s number one sports book right now new customers can bet $5 get 150 in bonus bets if that first $5 bet wins the fandle Sportsbook app gives you everything you need to place live bets on the NFL all in one place so when you get 100 in the middle of the game you can check out the latest stats VI live play byplay and so much more on the same page where you place your bets just visit fanduel.com ucss to join today never waste a hunch make every moment more with FanDuel an official Sportsbook partner of the NFL a couple of before we bring Sean real quick couple of injury notes don’t do that b when we do a read it comes up it pops it pops them up automatic uh well you can bring Sean up it’s fine I’m just going to read these couple of quick injury notes Joel bonio and David njoku not expected to practice today due to injuries bonio back injury and the joku hamstring injury uh let’s bring in Shawn now there he is Sean how are you what’s up fellas I’m good how are y’all we’re doing we’re doing good uh we were just talking with Leroy hord a little bit ago and he made an interesting comment about jamus obviously jamus played you know had his worst game as as a Browns quarterback this past week and he made a really fascinating comment about he said that his his biggest concern about jamus is that he feels like he doesn’t have a feel for the game in terms of what type of game it is like the week before you had to throw for a million yards and put up all these big numbers to beat Denver they didn’t but that was the type of game he needed to play whereas he felt like this had to be a much more conservative game plan and and it wasn’t a game to be as aggressive and he didn’t have a good feel for that what would you say to that I think you guys are watching a different game than I was watching I didn’t say it this is what Leroy hord said I don’t play me jamus play you said jamus played his his worst game yes I thought Jame I thought jamus played winning football I mean let’s put it in context first of all they’re playing in my opinion the team is capable of winning the Super Bowl this year T Lawson and that defense are really good uh he threw two interceptions but the first interception is just a I mean that’s a Hall of Fame play by Keanu Benton all but he just he just laid it up there Sean no did you watch did you watch the whole play yeah he locked it up with six Defenders no no no no no no no no go back and rewatch The play it’s a perfectly thrown ball to Nick chub keano Benton is playing defensive tackle on a screen play he rushes to the right realizes that it’s a screen reroutes it’s not even in the picture when jamus throws the ball go Cuts in front of chub and picks it like it’s a phenomenal play sort of like the week before with the one uh I think it was B bonio I think his name uh Bono had from the Broncos right that’s a phenomenal play and here’s what’s so crazy when people get focused on the quarterback position and they don’t know how to evaluate it if Dustin Hopkins who’s paid to make field goals just makes his field goals that’s a 1313 game James drove him down the field at the end of the first half it’s a 107 it’s a 13-7 game at Halftime right Dustin misses the field goal before the first half at the end of the first half it should be 1310 jamus drives him down the field to begin the second half Dustin misses another field goal it should be 1313 am I missing something then all of a sudden the Steelers ball got a lead take it to 2 hold on they take it no hold on a second go ahead because now now they now they extend the lead 277 and James puts together a 14 15 play drive that ends in a touchdown in joku I hear you but in the end he only got them in the end zone twice and the second time was when the Steelers had a huge lead so they probably were playing defense a little differently no well is is it is it Jam’s fault that stefansky and Ken dorsy call the worst fourth and one play in the history of football well I I don’t know that they CED I I think it’s possible jamus changed the play which he did which he did that play go that play had three motions on it the one where they motion Jerome forward back to tail back and handed the ball to him on some kind of little ridiculous like uh mini like outside kind of Zone playing against tackle for L you know the play I’m talking about know exact it was an awful play I don’t know what the I don’t know what the original design was but what what transpired is not what was called where the confusion was I stansky said that after the game that’s not what we were supposed to do so I don’t know what the I haven’t found out yet what the design was but it wasn’t that well damn show looked like everybody was running the same play to me they just didn’t execute it well so I would like fany to clear that one up cuz I I would have me scratching my head and I’m not trying to take blame off of anybody I’m just saying if you really look at that game I mean I thought James played winning football I’ll be honest with you Elijah Moore got a run full speed say what you I listen to the broadcast I heard Tony Romo say jamus could should check that ball down but listen man if I asked you was Elijah Moore running as fast as he could on the second interception what would you say I listen I I I’ll tell you what I I I see David and joku sometimes and David and joku he’s the worst he’s the worst rout running tight end in football he be walking a little bit he be walking a little bit ter now here’s here’s so some people now what do you say about this because we was just talking to Leroy and sometimes when it comes to the game right sometimes when it comes to throwing the ball or or throwing interceptions and turnovers when people say sometimes you got to look at it at a game and be like I you know what I’m not going to put the ball in In Harm’s Way I’m gonna be extra careful I’m GNA be extra safe about it do you think that that um jamus Winston has a problem with not understanding that or why do you believe that it seems that people will be making these superhero plays and picks against jamus Winston um that seemed to be more disproportionate to other quarterbacks well I think because he has The Narrative of being uh turnover prone his his anytime he makes a mistake I mean it’s highlighted I mean it’s magnified I’m telling you guys he threw a pick on a on a on a screen play and you got to go back and rewatch that play Keanu B and makes an unbelievable play to get that interception and then the second pick after I think they got a for they they caused the fumble they were down I think 13 or 14 tell me Elijah Moore is running full speed this is a quarterback talking to y’all Elijah Moore is not running full speed on that seam route he can run faster than that and if he does that’s a perfectly thrown ball he’s gonna walk walks into the end zone for a touchdown catch I gotta go check it out yeah you gotta go rewatch some of this stuff man because it’s easy when you’re watching the game on TV to get caught up in your emotions it really is especially when there’s a a a predetermined narrative that already exists but wait Sean it’s not a narrative it’s the truth jamus no it’s not jamus has more turn wait hold on Sean jamus Winston has more turnovers since he came in the league per game than any player in in the league so watch this all turn all interceptions aren’t the same here’s what I mean by that oh you remember you know Brock pie from the Niners right yeah uh Brock P’s first year as a starter I was doing a similar show in San Francisco and everybody’s ranting and raving about Brock py and I said listen Brock py is the luckiest quarterback in the history of the NFL he threw more balls In Harm’s Way than anybody I had ever seen but instead of getting picked they were batted down every tip ball was dropped by the defense like so sometimes the turnovers there is an element of Fortune attached to it sure but that’s for every quarterback on every quarterback I know but what so what I’m telling you is as when I watched the film I didn’t have a problem with either of the turnovers in the in the Browns game I thought the D tackle made a a a all-time great play on the screen and I thought Elijah wasn’t running running full speed on the seam route so to me that’s different that’s different than a guy throwing the ball into coverage right to somebody else I guess what I’m trying to say and we’re going to break down both those plays that’ll air on the WKYC show on Friday we’re going to look at James’s two tou interceptions now now I will say this do you have I thought there was were some throws that he was inaccurate on that that he missed I thought the inaccuracy was was there what do you make of there’s a few few plays where he sailed the balls the football what it was it mechanical was it just he didn’t understand the defense why do you think that he would he missed some of those throws early I I thought ter real Austin did a really really good job defensively of mixing up some looks I thought the the pressure bothered jamus a little bit more than I had seen it bother him before because all of his misses were overthrows MH and he’s normally super fundamentally sound he couldn’t step into a couple throws I think there was one the uh is 81 Woods that’s his name Woods yeah yeah yeah Michael Woods yeah he overthrew 81 one time on the sideline I thought I thought he overthrew one more to Elijah but other than that I thought he played a real good game and this is me capping for jamus I mean you guys have had me on here all year you know I’m Fair evaluator uh I evaluated deshun Watson I thought extremely Fair the entire time I’m just telling you sometimes the narrative gets in the way of what actually happened Sean let’s talk about some other things I don’t think I don’t think I ever had full speechless before you had you did you had me speechless there because I I’m going to be honest with you it does feel like you’re capping for jamus Winston a little bit I mean that’s why that’s why I said that because I wanted to yeah I wanted to be very clear that I don’t have a dog in this fight if jamus get 60 million next year from the Browns I don’t get any of it you think somebody’s gonna pay million no no I’m I’m saying it for context why I’m not caping I’m not invested in in in whatever happens to jamus I’m just being a fair evaluator of what I saw when I looked at the all 22 film from the Steelers Browns game fair enough uh let’s talk about the fact that the Browns obviously a 3 and 10 you know it’s a completely lost season at this point as much as you like what jamus has done do you think they should at some point this year start DTR and see what he’s got or or no I think the Brown’s got to make a decision on what they’re gonna do with DeShaun Watson well let let Hope they’ve already made that well well and in my opinion if they have then because I mean des’s having a good time shout out to desan that’s a hell of a view can’t imagine what that room cost man hey man hey he don’t hype him up don’t don’t hype him up I don’t do not hype them up they were the kids was awake and in bed and you done woke them up talk about I got a new video game for them they out there going crazy now Sean along those lines along those lines of that picture and him being in that spot a lot of people in Cleveland lost their line over it a lot of people said it’s not a big deal you wanted him out of Cleveland he’s out of Cleveland here’s where I fall on it if he was if he was committed and believed he was going to be back next year as the quarterback of the Browns he should be in Cleveland full-time rehabbing if if Patrick Mahomes was hurt Patrick Mahomes would be in Kansas City rehabbing if Joe burrow was hurt he’d be in Cincinnati the whole time rehabbing he’d be at the games I I don’t think he’s back next year as the starter so you know whatever but if if they thought and if he thought he was the guy going forward wouldn’t he still be here and be around the team I just think Des wat I just think DeShaun Watson’s ton de I think he lives in an alternate universe I thorough agree with that I don’t think he has anybody around him to like kind of you know keeping measur because at the end of the day I’m My Brother’s Keeper right like I went to battle with these guys I’m going to be in the building even if I’m rehabing I’m going to be at the game even if I’m hurt because I’m supporting my brothers like I only got what a month left in the season hell with all that money he got on the season off I can go anywhere I want if Lamar Jackson gets hurt is Lamar Jackson gonna be in Miami rehabbing or is he gonna be in Baltimore you can’t you can’t use use Lamar because Lamar skipped the playoff game the other year he he was mad about his contract he can’t use Lamar wow he be he was accused of that I don’t know if that is that I don’t know that we know that for sure yeah okay believe what I would say this I would say this I thought it was distasteful to rub it in everybody’s face by posting a video hey man hey I’mma tell you this I’mma tell you how I feel about it look when they and this is how deshaan Waton probably feel about it when y’all booed me all bets are off I don’t care what you feel like like forget the fans G what about it what about his teammates Sean was talking well Sean do Sean this is the way they talk to us when we play ball they only worry about the guys that’s on the on trip if you injur if you on the sideline I can’t worry about you dog like I we got a game to go win DeShaun Watson like like if you’re a defensive lineman I always had this thought if you’re a d lineman you supposed to be worried about Russell Wilson not what DeShaun Watson is doing with his his his beautiful wife or girlfriend in in in a in a beautiful view at the end of the day the the league is cold and calculated because it him posting that ain’t got going to have no no difference in whether he going to play or not if he can’t play if he can’t play well he not going to get another job I’m going to shock you and be the minority opinion here I think Jame’s wife is hotter than deshaun’s girl she’s more she’s more James’s wife is more are we really going to do this right now I’m just giving my opinion James’s wife is more girl next door I’m sitting this one out as a as opposed to supermodel I think that I like that look better Hey Hey listen there’s there’s there’s Rules of Engagement I can’t say it’s all compliment I’m not sitting here and rating other man woman Sean agrees with me I know secretly he does but he can’t say hey they they going to revoke they going to revoke bull credential hey Sean knows this Rules of Engagement I ain’t never met Sean in real life that’s like me meet him for the first time and me say listen man your wife man boy I tell you unacceptable SE under no circumstances does that go down I don’t if I see Sean I don’t even see his wife we know look I don’t acknowledge her I’m like hey hey hey I’m over here this is my guy right here but over here we don’t even see that all right I’ll get serious Sean let’s wrap it up with a serious question uh is it acceptable that jamus Winston’s Barber is white is that acceptable to you because I’m a little offended by it yeah when you from the south now some white boys that can cut that’s what I’m hearing I didn’t know this and they can cook collge greens all that they that’s going a step too far colllege so so a lot of the white people in in the South are like part black anyway like cuz they grew up around that culture you know it’s it’s different down there bull well I mean I I grew up uh in in New York City not the South but I grew up in New York City I wasn’t around white people all the time around you know I can’t cut I can’t cut G’s hair those are aliens those are aliens people from New York like y are y’all even American hey hey hey hey hey G they can have 100,000 people on one side W nobody say hello how you doing nothing cat’s getting beat up that’s that’s not true that’s that’s now that’s a false narrative Sean that is a false narrative right there bu like protect yourself you letting them punch you in the face you can’t walk around with the camera that’s annoying yeah hey in the South it could be five people on the sidewalk man they have your grandma name your daddy uh bir place and all that in the conversation it’s a different part of America D that’s true oh it is all right fair enough Sean good stuff man we’ll talk to you next week hey happy holidays fellas man all right I can’t believe we’re going to get to uh some great news some injury news after a quick word from built Rewards well before you do that Mike we got to mention we’re going to save that for the end of the show okay Tom Hamilton can I say it Tom Hamilton got in the whole of Fame yeah it’s phenomenal congratulations I thought he was already in he’s in the broadcast he been a finalist multiple times it’s long overdue but great great that he’s in we’ll talk more about it later we are going to get to lat I promise but we’ve all been frustrated sometimes feeling like we’re burning cash with rent payments and it’s frustrating but here’s the deal guys 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sent you join built.com lockdown NFL to start earning points with your rent payments today guys Greg Nome is headed to the IR with a hamstring injury he suffered against the Pittsburgh Steelers Kevin stefansky said moments ago that he will not require surgery but him going to the IR means he’s out at least four games and that is the remainder of the Season he has a fifth year option next season and after that there’s no more years or money left on his deal with the Browns they pick up fifth year option already they had to yeah yeah right right so my question to you guys is in theory he could be back next season because of the fifth year option but do you think that Greg Nome has played his last snap as a member of the Cleveland Browns good question G start dang y’ just want y y’all going tough today is this his last game go right to the life points huh okay uh I mean I don’t think unless they decide they going to move they already picked up his money like right they’ have to trade him they got to trade him and I don’t what do you think you can get for I don’t know how much is he getting on the fifth year option do you know M it’s 13.7 million I mean that that’s a lot of money for a at best average slot Corner yeah um I I don’t I just don’t think they can move him like that yeah I think he’s going to be here I think they got to eat that like they not going to be able to they’re not going to cut him no no he’ll be here I don’t know that he’ll be here I think next year’s probably his last year oh absolutely yeah but uh well I I I think he’ll be back next year who’s taking that contract like it’s I know it’s only one year but what or like what would you give up nobody’s given up anything for that so why would like if somebody’s given a late round draft pick why would the Browns do that I mean he’s not terrible I he’s had you know I we get on him some but he’s not a horrible player he’s just average he’s just a guy you know he’s not worth where he was drafted certainly but he’s just a guy but yeah I mean you’re not going to just give him away for nothing so yeah I’m I’m he’ll be here I mean now look Martin emberson you you waited too like I think both of them is shown because at one point in time we thought we were going to have a decision to make Martin Emerson Greg Nome Denzel Ward already making money I don’t think you got to make none of them decisions Martin Emerson you kind of looking Jason you were another like Earl you were high on Martin Emerson yeah but I’ve been slowly backing out for I’ve slowly retracted my grace from you yeah yeah no can I throw an idea out to you guys real quick sure yeah and just turns to the Newsome because this is kind of what I was thinking when I asked the question I I actually agree I do think he’s back but when we talked about last year in the draft and the Browns trying to move up in the draft Yeah it was new and a pick to move up does he have more or less value now in a scenario like that because he’s entering the final year of his deal the money’s already I think he’s got less because he was coming off probably his best season of the four P yeah I I don’t think his values changed I don’t think it was very high to begin with I I don’t think his values changed very much over the last year yeah but if anything has gone down not up it probably hasn’t changed much and we were probably wrong to suggest he would be part of a trade cuz but this year he’s he’s I mean nobody’s how many slot Corners are getting 13 million I know he sees himself as an outside corner but he’s not yeah um yeah he’s not I don’t think he has any trade value certainly what do you think what do you think 13 million ranks on an average annual basis for quarterbacks yeah but that’s not fair cuz he’s a slot Corner what I’m just saying where do you think it in general I bet it’s number one for slot Corners are top three or four I for overall I’ll say it’s like 12th what are you saying I mean are we going 60 90 you know what I mean like two corners per team is 60 if you’re throwing slot Corners a 90 you think he’s 12th out of 90 yeah that’s probably too high I I think he’s like middle of the pack in terms of money yeah where the 13 million right if we’re going to go 90 right yeah 35th is yeah I mean but how many second Corners no but Mike’s just asking of all the corners where would his 13 million yeah just where do you think 13 I’ll say I’ll say 30 something and that’s based on 40th or something what their salaries are this year 40th boy you’re close it’s 14th I should have stuck with my yeah wow basis wow Jason talk me out of it I thought I was off with the high quarterback number no you both you were spot on here are the corners here the because nobody’s taking that because he’s a first round pick right right here are the corners yeah that make more on a perear basis than Greg Newsome who on his fifth year next year will making 13.7 million these the cornerbacks that make more yeah Carlton Davis of the Lions I don’t know if he’s is he any good I don’t know he just signed a contract last offseason he the bition he’s their number one corner uh diadre Lenor of the ners their number one corner Jaylen Johnson of the Bears their number one corner lerus Sneed number one on Tennessee yeah Tyson Campbell of jaguars who got the big extension he’s been hurt all year but good player Travon digs of the Cowboys yeah hit or miss lesea ladimore former Saints now commanders Marlon Humphrey Denzel Ward AJ Terrell Jer Alexander Pat ceran and jayen Ramsey we’re talking The Best of the Best in football so what are is it are they all bunched together or like where’s the drop like what where’s the point so there are five cornerbacks that make 20 million or more Ward Terell Alexander ceran and R I don’t need the Nam so five make 20 or more and then what then seven make 19 or more and then Greg and then 17 then it drops Carlton Davis is the closest to Greg at 14.8 what’s the drop below him you know uh 13.5 wow yeah he’s right above nobody taking that he he who’s going to take him as the 13th highest paid corner and and by the way by the way that looks crazy they signed him to a fifth year why would they do that because you have to make the decision last season yeah they had to make com off Good Year and I think that they I said this before I think that they were trying to take care of him because he was the good soldier and moved inside and they were rewarding him well now we got a bunch of rewards out there I mean bounties it’s only one year so it’s not the end of the world and again he’s not a terrible player you can’t really you don’t really want to restructure it next year and that because now you’re just kicking dead money down right and you’re already doing that with a lot of other guys so how many bad contracts do the Browns have I mean they’re adding up you got the kicker in his that’s two right there we already talked about wat de money dead money next year would be I think amar’s got dead money for next year I don’t think you have that handy Mike who who is on who’s got dead money on the brown contract definitely Deshawn if they cut him definitely Des the kicker got dead money well he he doesn’t have dead money cuz he’s still on the team but he’s garbage and they gave him he’s Garbage I’d have to I’d have to do some digging and try and sort it out to off the top of my do you have the Browns cap hits for next year every player like okay 225 active roster yeah the dead cap hit or just the overall cap just cap hit next year or dead cap hit if it’s a player who’s gone we’re going to go down it’s worth it or not worth it keep going you guys are not going to like this list I’m just telling you right now this going to piss a lot of people people off talk Hard Knock next goad all right this is for 2025 the cap hit for next season and if the player’s gone you can give us the dead cap hit too but if it’s player if you tell me they’re gone I’ll give you the day cap here all right Deshawn Watson 73 million disaster yeah Denzel Ward 24.5 that’s fine that’s not bad miles Garrett best contract in football 19.7 oh yeah that’s a steel okay now you guys ready yeah yeah Jack Conlin 19.5 he makes more f it’s not nearly as bad as I thought when they signed it cuz he’s been hurt that’s 20 million but it’s 20 million for a right tackle no bad who’s you know medoc good he’s he’s prob better than the rest of his comp but it’s not as bad as like a year ago if I would have heard that we been like oh my God now it’s bad but not the worst go ahead Wyatt teller 14.4 and bonio 14.4 those are okay but they could probably get out of bonio couldn’t they the dead cap I’m looking at SPO track right now I like with the cap better but they don’t sort it as well so this is from SPO track but the dead cap if teller’s cut next year is1 19 million and bonio if he’s cut is 31 because they’ve both been restructured yeah that’s not good that’s not that’s horrible but tell and bonio 14 million they’re Fair I’ve got the dead money right here on give us just give us a couple more guys and then let’s do the dead money goad Newsome is 13.7 en joku 11.8 Dalvin Tomlinson 11.5 Judy eight that’s good that’s good po hasn’t been that bad overall hasn’t been that bad poic is what poic is 7.8 then you got Thornhill 5.6 if you cut him it’s 12 yeah that’s bad bad agbo 5.5 not great and then you’re looking at a bunch of guys you know it’s not as bad as you said it’s going to make people angry but it’s not that bad I I didn’t think it was that crazy just the Watson contract over everything what’s the dead cap J amar’s 22 A5 million cap hit zidus Smith is 14 million so you got 36 million in dead cap for two guys who not on the team and if you have to cut Watson it’s 1 172 172 no yeah it would be if I don’t think they’re going to cut him if you cut them it would be like an $87 Million Dead cap yeah no it’s not 172 it’s 172 over two years years so that oh it’s giving me the f I was giv you the F so that Amari Cooper and zarius Smith they got paid that that’s a hit for them playing for somewhere else right yes yeah oh wait hold on if that’s the full number then the dead cap for bonio isn’t 31 it’d be half of that okay okay teller would be so teller would be 10 million dead cap would be 15 they’re not GNA do either of those and then they’ve got like Quinton Jefferson’s 2 million caki eeka is 400,000 David Bell’s 200,000 uh Nathaniel he’s not cut yet David Bell this is just a dead money for next year so that’s they got about 40 million in dead money for next year without without Des they really can’t cut him because Watson that’s over 120 million of dead cap do it that’s half your cap he’s on a roster next year it’s done I I didn’t know I didn’t know zarus Smith and Mari Cooper you can’t play him they can’t play him I’d send him home I would send him but he you can’t cut him either it’s a terrible position to be in but they that’s you know it’s a tough spot to be in they actually mentioned his name in Hard Knocks last night they did not in the first episode mention it twice and we’re going to talk about they’re totally avoiding it but we’re going to get into the Hard Knock episode after a quick word from ice Shaker if you guys want a Browns gift for the biggest Browns fan in your life this holiday season we have the perfect gift for you guys it is the ice Shaker which is now officially licensed with the NFL NHL NBA NCAA and Major League Baseball it was created by and used by the gronowski Brothers Ice Shaker sold over 1 million bottles they’ve changed the game with workout bottles this is the gift you’ve been looking for go to ice shaker.com and use code lockon NFL at checkout to save 25% on your order it is Kitchen grade stainless steel bottles that won’t absorb order odor like the plastic bottles do their patented twist and agitator breaks up the powder but is silent when you shake it instead of that annoying metal ball noise order your team branded bottles today at ice shaker.com use code lockdown NFL for 25% off your order ice Shaker show your support for your teams with the best branded workout bottles on the market which are the ice shakers B Hard Knocks episode 2 the Browns were heavily featured you and I have already talked about some of the key points to hit on what was your big takeaway from the second episode of the AFC North hardox and once again and I hate to say it but Mike Tomlin just I mean I know the way they cut things up it just you know you can go with whatever narrative you want but he said the things he said MH and Mike Tomlin just looks great in this thing not that stefansky looks bad but he’s not Mike Tomlin it’s just Mike Tomlin talks to the players in such a kickass manner but at the same time you know he kind of loves you yeah he really I mean we did I I don’t ever plug yeah I doely rarely do I plug you brought it up with Sean earlier you brought it up on the C show last night you brought on but but it always fits it fits I’m just busting your balls uh I didn’t write it our staff did something on tomin last week that was really well done went back and talked to former players a lot of guys that you forgot unless you’re a big time Steelers fan who just Rave about the way that he handles locker rooms the way that he treats guys how personable he is they have family tragedies he’s like go come back when you’re right and don’t go back until then he’s just knock but he’s also a badass like oh he’s not putting up with nonsense it’s a great balance seems yeah like he he can get up in your ass like in a big time way that’s crazy pause that’s that’s a crazy pause on one you say that as if you’ve never heard that expression footb he might we might have to actually cut that edit Earl if you listening edit that all the way out are you telling me you never heard that expr we don’t want that on the live version or the on you guys know what I’m saying here and yet he does it like tough but love and that’s what you want I would think is a player you want to know you follow it up with tough and love I was going to say bull wants Tomlin tough and love I mean’s wrong with you guys as a player G Let’s Get Serious here don’t you want to be coached hard by but still feel like the coach is looking at off of your best interest so that’s a great way to phrase this and I’ve been trying to say this forever we look at Sports and we don’t understand how much Charisma plays a factor in the way you play sometimes you there’s different leadership styles some leadership styles is the the nice Tony dunie I’m a family man and man of God then there’s people that are Bill bich I’m the dictator and I’m just he going to fear you into playing well and then you have your coaches that are just very smart they you know they’re analytic they they call they draw plays up and they’re mad scientists didn’t work but then you got people like Mike Tomlin who are charismatic leaders and they make you forget about the things that you are deficient in they they maximize what you do great and by maximizing what you do great you feel like that person is bought into you that person cares about you that person understands but he’s not he’s not blowing smoke he he’s he’s genuine in what he’s saying and that’s the part of football that people I think we’re trying to strip away that sometimes we don’t get that we get the chance to see what with Hard Knocks is that type of stuff that he’s doing matters when your body is hurting and you’re tired and you have lost two or three games in a ro it matters the guy that’s standing up in front of you telling you why you should continue to go through those you know I look at the great generals the great all the great generals have a personality where they’re not afraid Alexander the Great leads from the front he in the front lines with with his people and Alexander the Great got people to fight hard for him that he just conquered and similarity to his army like some the the great leaders and the great people that stand in front of you can really inspire you to do more than you than what you worth and that’s why Mike Tomlin has a standard that’s why they play the same way that’s why he can be somewhere 20 years in a row because each person has a different relationship with him so he establishes that from Jump Street so it’s not the Steelers the what the way they do it he the Steelers are an extension of the way Mike hand Mike tomin handles his business and that’s why it’s important to have a leader that can exude that sort of Charisma we’ll follow somebody yeah when they when they show and when when they show the scenes it’s such a small sample size it’s unfair but when they show the scenes of the big meeting room with the coaches Zack Taylor and Kevin stefansky at times it feels a little cringey it just feels a little awkward when they’re talking to the big group right I think that’s and with Mike Tomlin it never feels that way and again I’m we’re seeing just small Snippets of it yeah but Mike Tomlin it feels like he’s just in the groove and with Zack Taylor and and Kevin stefansky there’s there’s a level of he seems a little uncomfortable up in the front of the group or or I don’t know what exactly what it is but it’s just not as smooth it’s not as comfortable and that’s got to matter on some level it does on a lot of levels yeah it Ma it and this is why I don’t I I go to and a lot of people get mad and upset when you say this but guys it’s just it’s this is human nature when we look at uh you know even look at our our politics in this country we follow people it ain’t necessarily you know what you say or what what you’re voting for what or what exactly is the platform or what’s your economic plan is do I believe in you that yes true do you inspire me to get up and go vote for you or do you understand where I’m coming from and it’s about understanding where people come from and you can you can lead people and really not have X’s and O’s there’s some coaches that are CEO types that don’t relatively know offense or defense I don’t know how smart a guy or good a coach Dan Campbell is no but I could see him in the locker room that he has his whole team fired up and they want to run through a wall for him yeah and that’s what you need they they he has and I look and here’s the thing he he realizes that your best players have to leave from the front when he goes to people and he says hey I I need you to get the dline fired up when you talk he’s talking about uh you know when he goes ands to his he’s them those guys are your real leaders those are the people that hold people together like Hey we’re not doing the drill right yeah the the team that’s great that has leaders that say guys hey coach I got this hey players meeting hey we need to finish these drills we need to finish running through the line This is not we we’re not playing up to the standard and we going to stay after practice I’m going to make sure we stay after practice those are the teams that get done because they’re going to be self-disciplined they’re going to be self-leading and he empowers his people to do that that’s the most impressive thing about it because he’s talking to his he’s talking to his generals he’s talking to the people the the the coordinators and the guys man and then they go in and and they know Mike Tomlin and gave them the freedom to talk that talk like I like it Jason what was the what stood out to you from hard Kno last night uh honestly I’m a nerd I was impressed how much of the Bengals they got in and the Monday night game that was I was fascinated by that quick turnaround yeah cuz the week before they didn’t get the Broncos and Browns and Browns yeah they showed a lot more of the other teams though I think that was more of how much time they had in the episode can I a couple other Browns things I found interesting yeah and then we’ll get to the Cavs uh on the jamus interception when stefansky showed how they all hit their fastest speed of the game chasing down the that was good by I thought that was just a cool little snippet seeing jamus with his kids I thought was a nice little that was real sweet nice that was sweet I like that that’s that that family stuff yeah I thought it was cool how they showed Tomlin getting his guys ready to stop miles and the respect he clearly has for Miles Garrett and then the but but he doesn’t go too far no cuz Mike Tomlin goes I I don’t have to you know go crazy about miles Garett you could look him up on Wikipedia good they called him a game record him a game record they also showed stefansky getting his guys ready for TJ watt so they showed both sides of that equation and speaking of the defensive line room when they had the good ja Cesar I think I pronounced Jack C Jack CES Jack ceser uh when they had their their meeting and Miles talked about you know Finding Your why to play through these last four games we’re eliminated we got to find our why and then Shelby Harris who Shelby I think is more of a leader on this team than we probably give him credit for he’s not one of the guys you think of when you think of a leader on the Browns but he’s been around for so long uh he talked about you either part of the solution or you’re part of the problem and these next four games you’re playing to prove which side of the equation you fall upon yeah and you know it’s not groundbreaking Insight I’m sure that conversation was every year it was really it was really cool to hear him deliver that message yeah he was talking to the young players about like this is your career this is your career on the line you when when that I’m glad you brought that up because when I was looking at it I said to myself I hope everybody realize realizes that there’s no such thing as tanking inside locker rooms that should have put that should have dedic that to anybody that watched it because those players like he’s saying oh so we’re tanking so somebody could take your spot because if like think about it you you put that on tape and you three in something they’re going to bring some people in they sign 12 15 kids every single year and you’re the guy that’s that’s fighting the battle for your job the NFL the one thing that they have they’ve eliminated all of the tanking stuff that all the other leagues do by no guaranteed contracts these people ain’t got no money on the books like that 90% maybe that’s a little higher I I’ll say 90% of NFL players it’s year to year it’s a year-to-year league yep and you don’t have the luxury and that’s what I was saying like your tape is your resume yeah and teams are going to be watching your tape saying when the team was out of it how did this guy respond and that’s going to determine whether or not they want you on their team next year I also you know I I thought the story with uh Jamar Chase and the little kid that has battle lukemia twice who’s a big Bengals fan I thought that was a cute story you know so often we it’s a big story when a player does something gets in trouble or whatever and we highlight these things there are a lot of players that are doing good things doing great charity work and those aren’t as interesting stories generally but I thought it was sweet am I cynical so I I look at it from a media standpoint like all right so so how much of this could I mean am I tripping on this and I don’t understand why people be calling me it’s just Spam is going crazy holiday season I don’t know you’re not getting no money from me I’ll get it you get it when I get it um now so I’m sitting there and I’m thinking in the league office they’re like all right so listen um we got these stories breaking all the time our guys are going to do something but disproportionately we get bad pressed by a couple of guys what if we do Hard Knocks during the season yeah but we give him some Slice of Life we’ll show little thing do you think this is a plan by the NFL to be like hey we can slide we can slide some things in here to to give us a I think there’s absolutely a partnership or agreement I don’t know about specifically that example not not that case but but there’s some sort of partnership between HBO and the NFL for the fact that they have avoided the Deshawn thing as much as they have yeah like they they aren’t even touching it not not even touching it and then and then they’re giving Stories the Jamar Chase thing they’re giving they’re like hey we’re going to show jamus Winston and his kids like all of these things not to say that it’s it’s some sort of conspiracy theory but it’s something cuz I I I would find myself sitting there watching it and being like it’s funny how great content can make you change your mind about somebody no that’s true and Jamar Chase has a good reputation anyway but it gives you but yeah and there probably is some of that but that doesn’t mean there aren’t a lot of guys doing good charity already right so they just I think they just highlight it a little better and and shout out to brics’s Dad wearing the old school Anthony Muno Jersey my favorite Bengal when I was a kid all right let’s go Mike we got a Cavs topic to wrap up today’s show if you missed the ultimate Cavaliers show last night Jason and I went over one thing we got right in our preseason predictions for the Cavs one thing we got wrong about our preseason predictions for the Cavs and one thing we still need Clarity on as we go through the next 2/3 3/4s of the Season whatever number you want to get to and because Jason wasn’t supposed to be on the show today yeah I asked Jason this question to wrap up last night’s show interesting there’s a report out there that Jimmy Butler is potentially in the tradem market Shams of ESPN reported the the heat are listening to trade offer are at least willing to entertain the idea the Cavs don’t have the assets to acquire Jimmy Butler without breaking up the core force so I’m going to ask you guys in a second would you be willing to break up the core 4 in an attempt to get Jimmy Butler but I asked Jason what he thought you guys would say on the show last night let’s take a listen yeah this we’re gonna ask this on the show tomorrow that same question would you break up the core 4 what does bull say yes or no no I think he says no what does g say yes what does Dustin say there we go yeah that’s you’re right I was thinking why after they answer then we can change our opinion Bas you guys are integral guys you guys wouldn’t change your answers because of what have you met these guys before me come on B’s a man of integrity and I think we all know what G’s going to say I’m the Duke of n fine so no one actually heard the answers we’ll play goad you give your ANS would you would you be willing to break up to core 4 if it meant you by the way 92% of our fans would say no to that I’m going to put it in the chat no so which one does it matter does it matter which I wanted to core for it’s it’s Deal’s Choice the question is would you be willing to break up the core 4 if it meant you could get Jimmy Butler the heat said we need any of the four plus whatever would you be willing to make that trade in order to get Jimmy Butler man I’m not doing it unless it’s for Jared Island so you would say yes uh and and and it I if You’ asked me this off season I would have said probably 85% G Bush says yes yeah now it’s tough It’s a little tougher it’s 50 it’s about 52% to 48 cuz I I like H it allows them you know what I’mma say this if it was Jimmy Butler I’m might actually say no you know why I’m gonna say no because Jimmy Butler is older you only gonna get playoff Jimmy and I think I think Jared Allen and what he does defensively allows Evan Moy to be Evan Moy at this level so I’m going to say no because I got 41 Point Evan Moy it’s tough I would turn it down uh 48% no or 48% yes 50% no I’m not making a deal go ahead Bo so just to CL G you’re saying no you would not break up the core 4 no no okay both I 100% would break it up now I would not trade Moy and I would not trade Donovan Mitchell obviously but the other two 100% I would trade Darius or Jared Allen uh unless you guys who know better than I do would tell me oh it would be bad chemistry or if there was something like that that you think if if you guys thought it would be bad for the team for that perspective then I wouldn’t do it but if you guys said hey if you if you can get him you do it cuz he’s great you know whatever then a 100% I would trade I think Darius would have to be the guy they don’t want Jared Allen I I would think I don’t know B man a bio it it’d be it’s just more of a principle would you break it up for that kind of 100% And I listen I there’s there are not many players that I would do that for the way this team is playing and the reason I you’re probably right it’s not quite 92% but you know our fans Jason our fans when things are going well they don’t want to mess with it yeah so most there’s probably fans losing their mind that I’m saying I would trade Darius Garland in a trade for Jimmy Butler he’s Jimmy Butler I know Jimmy I know I could win a championship with Jimmy Butler before before Jason Goes we made a poll this morning on the community tab yeah would you break up the core 4 if it meant you could get Jimmy Butler 87% said no they would not break up the you guys didn’t hear the answers earlier well before you do Mike I will say this though I don’t love the question because it doesn’t I I think there’s a lot of people saying well I wouldn’t trade Mitchell or Moy like I said and so they’re saying no even though they might trade I would only look to I would only think about trading Allen um I would trade Garland 100% so that’s breaking up the core four yes yes here’s what Jason said last night and then we’ll dive into why we think it’s a good move or a potential bad move this from last night we’re g to ask this on the show tomorrow that same question would you break up the core 4 what does bull say yes or no no I think he says no what does g say yes what does Dustin say uh what brings back the best gambling return what makes him the most money you you’re right about DUS on both I’m shocked I’m shocked oh for two dag on Jason and I both said no we would not by the way way it okay you wouldn’t I would not he’s older why he’s got one year left on his deal yeah um I like the way that the Cavs have this set up for an extended run and I don’t think Boston’s going to be able to stay together I think Boston’s going to get too expensive I think their time is a lot shorter than people realize don’t you have to go for it when you have a chance absolutely and I they this is going for it yeah like they got a really good team yeah so I would I would not and he has a player it’s a player option right he’s got a player option for next year uh that that changes a lot listen if you guys who know basketball way better than I you say you wouldn’t do it then then I would CH I would say okay don’t do it it’s more for the fact that it could be a three-month rental I I’ll just say my only point was I don’t believe there there is a trade like I would consider in the right deal and I don’t know if there is a right deal trading either Allen or Garland I would not trade Moy or Donovan for anything I don’t think uh trading Darius for a rental I would not do that I and and Allen I don’t think is going to command as much in a trade because he’s a non-shooting big right so you’re not going to get as much for him would you trade Allen in theory if you can get Jimmy Butler in no I wouldn’t Brak up I wouldn’t would and is there a player out there that I would trade Jared Allen for yeah probably yes but not not Jimmy because of his age and the is there any player out there you trade Garland for is there what is there any player you trade Garland for sure probably yes yeah but but I mean it would I that was the one thing going back and watch from the episode the one thing that I said I got right is I didn’t think they necessarily had to break up the back court because they played well together two years ago it’s last year when Darius fell off had a bad year and everyone said oh you got to break them up I I didn’t think that you had to rush to break that up it’s two it’s two different conversations there was the story that we wrote in May about if Donovan resigns uh Rich may go to the Cavs and ask Darius to be moved that’s separate from can they fit together on the floor yeah I thought they could fit from a basketball pure basketball standpoint then I got another question from a pure basketball standpoint if they did move Allen for uh uh oh boy Butler Butler how how does that look I don’t think it looks anything because Mike’s right they got at a bio they got bamed so that just draft K who’s a seven foot guy so they would probably want Garland second of all is there anything to now maybe I got trolled you know the internet is is is there anything to this LeBron trade thing would you even I am I crazy to think that I don’t want LeBron on this team is that insane yes that’s insane yeah I’d still take him so so so do you think is there anything to that you don’t think he would screw up the chemistry of this steam that’s a risk and that’s part of the reason why I said I wouldn’t want Jimmy because you don’t want to mess with like what they have right now they’ve got the right pH balance yeah but I mean LeBron is still LeBron I’m sure his fans are losing their minds that we even having this conversation the the LeBron trade thing with golden state is fascinating what would the trade be I just saw it pop up yesterday I did too I thought it was it they have a ton of contracts that you could put together enough with LeBron already like just stay in the LA the the he’s got to he’s got to try to buy another championship like he’s the biggest store in basketball still is he he I mean he told me he he told us years ago I love Golden State I love everything that they do I could never play there just because of the Optics of the whole thing but he changed his mind all the time maybe he feels like enough time has passed they’ve they’re far enough removed from that he sunk that whole Laker team hasn’t he to some degree at this point he got him a championship they won a championship I saw a headline that if LeBron got traded bronny would have to get traded with him as if the Lakers wouldn’t want to give up bronnie no I package steel I was I interview Joe Varden yesterday for my podcast and I guess this is not surprising but I said I would bronnie even be in the G league if if it wasn’t for LeBron he said no probably not yeah one more question for you guys on the The Butler thing real quick in a basketball scenario and both we kind of talked this yesterday a little bit yeah I sent you the Tweet about a lot of teams are now interested in herb Jones which is going to raise his price which means he’s not as realistic as I once thought he was do you think the Cavs and we’ll go around the horn because we got super chats and I want to mention Tom Hamilton do you think the Cavs need some sort of upgrade at the three position if they are truly going to compete with Boston and whoever else for a championship just like just in a in a vacuum do you feel like they need to improve that spot probably I’d say probably I I in my heart of hearts and deep down inside I think the Cavs need one more piece whether it’s a three or whatever it is I just think I just think when they play the C Celtics I don’t know if they’re going to have enough yeah at the at that time scoring and somebody to get stops I just think that the Celtics are still yeah they still got too many people Jason do they need another piece I will say no but I do think that they could use more size and that doesn’t necessarily mean on the wing because if you play if you start Dean Wade at the three but can you trust Dean Wade that’s the problem yeah you trust him to stay that’s what I mean but but you can’t you can’t assume injury I mean but he’s so been so injury I know I know but but if you if you move him into the three now you need size on the bench you need a big off so I think could they use more size yes and it would be easier to find a backup big than it is to find a wing to plug you know what I mean so if you I I was really fascinated with that lineup with Dean at the three now what do you do with Max stru at that point you know I don’t know like Max came here to be a starter so I don’t know what you do with Max is there any chance Max dreu is part of a deal I mean sure like does he how much trade value does he have decent I think yeah I don’t think he his contract’s fine it’s not a not gross over by means yeah it’s not an anchor couldn’t he get them a better player than anybody else we’re talking about trading I still think Levert would have more value because it’s expiring and see I that’s where Mike and I disagree because I don’t think expiring teams aren’t teams aren’t interested in clearing their books now like they were 15 years ago I like it used to be a huge story and now itn’t talk about and now now what guys are doing is now they’re signing their extensions in one city and then asking for a trade a year or two later so cap space isn’t as valuable as it was if you’re a bad team though just use the Nets as an example yeah and then we got Tom Hamilton in Super Chat so this the last point on this but if you’re like the Nets would you rather trade CU they make 16 million they’re both right in that same range Levert and stru you rather get a guy that’s now off your books or you get a guy in while you’re trying to tank who’s a good player who’s still making 16 it depends where you’re at I mean I don’t want to complicate it depends where you’re at in your rebuild because I would I would like a veteran who came from heat culture who is a professional who knows how to carry himself who worked his way up from the bottom into a big time contract that would be a valuable piece in the locker room now if you want a tank for two years you know maybe not if if if tanking is so stupid you can’t guarantee yourself a number one pick anyway that little 12% chance is not so dumb but there’s there’s not Championship Contender there’s there’s teams in the middle Mike there I’m sure there’s I mean I don’t know off the top of my head but is there Pro are there some teams that are not having a good year but they still see themselves as maybe a contender next the Sixers yeah I mean like yeah whatever maybe the Sixers maybe the Bulls I don’t know I mean there there is a middle ground I’m just saying when you look at the teams that are most likely to be sellers it’s usually teams that are out of the playoffs and are trying and here’s the thing with tanking yes you want the number one pick but you really want a top five six seven pick you know like that’s why you’re you know you’re bad you’re going to be bad hey even if we don’t get one we’re going to get a top yeah whatever pick all right we got some super chats to wrap up the show and then we’re going to do a fun overtime topic and talk some hammy uh Hall of Fame but first super chat comes from Cody Lapin who says the Jimenez move is the right move especially if they reallocate the money to a legit starter or Corner Outfield bat don’t sleep on Ortiz he’s got great stuff as a three to five guy in the rotation and the very next Super Chat is from Casey Rush who says if I’m Jose I’m demanding a trade after Thea’s move yeah so you got both sides of the equation and back not a surprise uh Charles T says in sha King’s defense jamus did say in the postgame that the wide receiver needs to be in the right spot at the right time in that last interception he also says bull you’ve been out of pocket but hilarious today get him together G Jason why do you think Steelers fans hate Tomlin so much it’s crazy how much they hate on him because he hasn’t won of the playoffs you know what that’s just loud people on Twitter like I have a a my oldest friend is a huge Steelers fan he’s the only Steeler the only Steeler what how old is he same old same age as Me Oh Oh I thought you been like 104 like the oldest no we’ve been friends since like the fourth grade got shout out Andy Robbins so uh he is a big Steelers fan but he doesn’t he doesn’t do social social media he loves Mike Tomlin and I’m sure that there’s a large percentage I think I bet you most fans there like Mike Tomlin just a loud minority on social but they still exist even if they’re a loud minority they it’s still a pocket of fans that exists sure absolutely last Super Chat yeah Rob Cunningham says I hate when Sports pundits say players should get as much money as they can slash I don’t count a player’s monies but then when they’re not living up to the contract We complain about how we are hamstrung it’s too separate conversations if I’m a player right get every dollar you can I don’t blame a player but if you’re not leaving up to the contract you’re hurting your team right I don’t blame a player for getting as much as he can but as a sports pundit if it’s hurting the team that the guy’s making a lot of money I can complain about sep conversations I don’t blame him for it you can’t put you can’t put every meal into one pot hey man I’m I’m all for that conversation just don’t tell me where somebody’s going to go yeah it’s pretty obvious Deshawn Watson’s contract is bad for the Browns but he is the right he made the you know he you know back yeah money don’t give $1 back cash every check eat all that pasta give they give it to you they want to give it to you take it all right so Tom Hamilton’s a Hall of Famer we’ll do some more in overtime but we’ll start Tom very cool you know it’s been a while uh obviously he’s one of the legendary broadcasters we’ve had him on the show a number of times by all accounts a great guy you probably know him uh I love tomen he’s phenomenal he’s he’s so good favorite conversations are with him just hanging out in in spring training or pregame usually he’s busy pregame but right yeah he yeah he one of them dudes that get on the mic You’ be like man this dude just sound like he just talking like you know what I’m saying when you sounds like an old friend yeah just he like you talking and and it ain’t even no script no nothing he just on there spitting facts you be in a moment yeah man congratulations one of the we’ve been blessed you had him and Joe Tate yeah you didn’t had some Jim Donovan Jim Donovan you done had some some of the best come through here and and and Herb Score and but um as someone my age and Jason you’re not that much younger than me it’s like when I was a kid I listened to baseball on the radio oh yeah I never listened to football on the radio for me I I just didn’t you know my dad still listens to the radio it is something special even now about listening to a baseball game on the radio and when you have a special broadcaster like Tom Hamilton and so often a lot of these guys get in after they’ve passed away Tom Hamilton’s in the prime of prime of life right now and uh it’s great so kudos to him it’s welld deserved I know the our fans will be extremely excited more on on this in overtime coming up on the ultimate clev peace [Music]

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