📅 Published on: 2024-12-09 21:09:20

⏱ Duration: 01:03:43 (3823 seconds)

👀 Views: 287 | 👍 Likes: 9

📝 Video Description:

Ku Khahil of “Locked on Pistons” is back with Bryce and Omari this week. Together, the trio conduct a vibe check of the season in light of the Pistons’ blowout loss to the Bucks and their noteworthy recent win against the Knicks. After the break, the guys open up the conversation on player evaluations, including Jaden Ivey’s turnover struggles and Jalen Duren’s defensive stumbles. With a sample size of 25 games now played, the trio look to the future and game out what roster moves the team should make next. Should the Pistons pursue an upgraded center at the trade deadline or during the off-season? How can the organization better build around Cade for the future? Should the team consider a “stop-gap” type of a complimentary player to fill in the role next to Cade in the short-term? The guys analyze these hypotheticals and more.

Follow Omari on Twitter: @omarisankofa (https://twitter.com/omarisankofa?s=21&t=20HHeZN1gMTeWITXupRXHQ)

Read the latest from Omari on freep.com (https://www.freep.com/staff/2954035001/omari-sankofa-ii/)

Follow Bryce on Twitter: @MotorCityHoops (https://twitter.com/motorcityhoops?s=21&t=yxQgk9lyhbEirCCqBpuSKA)

Read the latest from Bryce on substack (https://motorcityhoops.substack.com/)

Pick up  “The Pistons Pulse” merch here! (https://usatodaystore.com/p/detroit-free-press)

🎙 Channel: Detroit Free Press

🌍 Channel Country: United States

📂 Tags:

detroit,michigan

🕵️‍♂️ Transcript:

[Music] hello and welcome to your go-to Detroit Pistons podcast the Pistons pulse co-hosted by me Bryce Simon of Motor City Hoops a former D1 Hooper and current teacher husband and father of three amazing kids and I’m Amari Sanko for the second Pistons beat rider for the Detroit Free Press and of course we’re always blessed to be joined by our producer Wes Davenport who wanted to get a little extra pin down love on the episode today as he eloquently named this episode the pin down with our guest uh just had to give Wes a little bit of fun there as you know you’re getting busy in the content creation world when you start misnaming all of the different podcasts that you do but you guys definitely should be listening to Wes and Blake over on the Detroit Bad Boys YouTube channel with the pin down Wednesday Thursday nights but today we have one of the best Pistons content creators there is guys there’s so much to go around here you got to be reading Omari at the Free Press you need to be reading my stuff at the Motor City hoop substack but you have to be listening to this guy daily subscribe to his YouTube channel where he’s breaking stuff down from the lock on Pistons podcast not looking at us right now coup not making eye contact as I introduce him you can explain that to the listeners our guy cah Hill so first of all thank you guys for having me always have fun with you guys but second so before we start recording I had to ask Bryce Omar how they record are I able to like look at the camera while like can they see me while they’re looking at the camera because I have a monitor on one side a monitor on the other side and then my camera right in the middle so it’s always a constant battle to like look at who I’m talking to but then also look back at the camera and make sure I’m looking at you guys who are watching so it’s like it’s a constant battle back and forth I’ve yet to be able to defeat so it’s funny like I’ve never picked up on that but now like that’s all I could see is you looking back from the Monitor and the cover like I never thought about it that hard was just that’s just the coup aesthetic kind of gazing off into back it’s not me gazing off I don’t want so I noticed it because I am very Reliant when I’m recording with somebody which is all the time on their interaction so at times whenever I like look at Amari whenever it’s just Amari and I recording and if I can tell he’s doing something else it actually affects me I’m like Amari you’re like come on lock in and I think that’s why I say your name all the time people call me out all the time for talking and I’ll be like Omari Amari and it I think it’s a just like a trigger of like I want to make sure we’re still locked in communicating so I had noticed it with coup but I thought he was always just looking at a different monitor looking up stats or something like that no I look up stats on one monitor but like this one right here where I’m looking like I’m looking right at you guys so like that’s a big thing for me too BR like I want to be able to look at who I’m talking to but then I started to realize like I’m not they probably think I’m not looking at them they all right real quick Dereck Brown says says man can’t wait to watch this episode let’s go we have some other comments we will get to later Harry says what up though bump says happy Sunday we’ll talk about Cade we’ll get to some of these I’ll star some of these other comments early we’ll get to them a little bit later I want to start here coup with Vibe checks that’s kind of what we always do here on the Pistons pulse in the season I want to look at the immediacy like the last few games right obviously coming off a win on Saturday night was really good to get that so we weren’t having to talk about a believe four game losing but we had the lost to the Sixers last Saturday lost to the Bucks in in that big inseason tournament game on Tuesday the lost to the Celtics on Wednesday a few days off then they beat the New York Knicks without Carl Anthony towns on Saturday where are your Vibes just over the last week before we really spread out and look at the whole season so Vibes overall are fine I I said it yesterday like this team certain players on this team are quite literally a roller coaster not just game to game but possession to possession like it’s it’s like it’s crazy what what some of these players put you through watching game to game but the team overall I think over the last two weeks or so they’ve struggled a little bit and I think there are some changes that might need to be made but overall I think that fans probably should still feel like better than and maybe anticipated because I think like what are they right now 10 and 14 10 and 15 10 and 15 yeah so I mean I think still even with with how they’ve lost a few of these games the last few weeks I always go back to like if I looked at the schedule before the season did I think that they’d be 10 and 15 at this point and for me no I didn’t think they would be so it’s always like that kind of perspective I want to keep whereas like yes they should have been some games that they could have played better should have won and definitely shouldn’t have put such a last basical effort out there but then also I go back to well you know where were they at compared to why I thought they would be and at the end of the day they are still ahead of where I think they would have been so I always try to keep perspective so I’d say that overall Vibes are fine but if you watch K’s Instagram live yesterday you think Vibes are Immaculate you think that it’s like they just won the championship which is great to see but yeah they are still on a 33 win Pace after the win last night I kind of looked at it late last night and this is the quickest they’ve gotten to 10 wins at least in the last five years um they started off 10 and 14 that’s time they made the playoffs and that’s the same track they’re on now so you know obviously still a lot of season left but you know I think you look at where this team’s been we don’t need to talk about last season but even before last year they weren’t getting win number 10 until like the end of December right so you know they’re several weeks ahead of pace compared to where they normally are and they had a really good win last night this is a good timed episode a well timed episode because that was probably one of their best four or five wins out of the 10 they’ve had so far yeah C what did you think about two games in particular you and I talked about the Bucks game and you know before that one was played so I want to get your thoughts on how that one went what you may have learned from that if anything in particular and then three games in a row they lose Vibes are kind of struggling a little bit overall and then again a really nice performance especially from Cade mik Beasley really hoop in no Cary towns but still a very good Knicks team specifically those two games over the last week just kind of your thoughts and takeaways from what you learned from those yeah so let’s start with the Bucks game the Bucks game I was thankfully the Pistons actually hooked me up with tickets shout out to the Pistons for me to get there so I was there live pretty good seats right behind the Pistons bench so you got to see and Bryce you know this Amari obviously you know this you’re at every single game there’s things that you pick up on when you’re at games that you won’t pick up on when you’re watching on TV such as like people talking on defense calling stuff out all that kind of things the game against the Bucks I thought they came out with the right energy and they they knew that it was a big game they came out acting like it was a big game Duran especially came out was playing really hard in the first six minutes or so but after that I think what ended up happening was the Pistons continue to show that they struggle to guard bigs that can spread the floor and as the game just continued to play on that became more and more and more of an issue and to be honest like another thing is is that the Bucks kind of just Flex their muscle like this is not the same Bucks team that was struggling the first what 11 games when they were like two- n or something it wasn’t the same thing this team is starting to win I think they’ won like six straight or something they they had a good win streak at one point and obviously they have Giannis and Dame and those two guys just kind of flex their muscle on the Pistons and that they just don’t have anyone to really guard Giannis and Dame and the way the Bucks are assembled really exposes some of the weaknesses the Pistons have on their roster they just don’t have the personel to match up against the Bucks and so I I don’t part of it was effort by some players I would say or just lack lack ofical or mental mental lapses I’d say by some players but overall I would say it was more so just a better team with the Better Play kind of justes really making their impact known and just suffocating you so I think that’s really what happened in the Bucs game though again they could have played a little better some players really could have been you know I’m sure we’ll probably toss by some of these players but some certain players can be a little better um but I think the Bucks mostly just Flex their muscle on the pisss and then the game yesterday for the Knicks I think again going back to the point of the Pistons not being able to guard stretch fives they didn’t have cat and it made it a lot easier to guard the Knicks Jericho Sims made it to where the Pistons maybe could I think Greg Kelo even pointed out they kind of had some players roaming on defense didn’t really have to concern themselves too much with Jericho Sims which really allowed them to play much better defensively as a team but I also would like to say I think Cade really set the tone defensively from the get-go as soon as the tip off happened there was a lot of talk especially from Brian scalini on like the Celtics broadcast a few nights ago that Kade wasn’t playing as much defense earlier in the game and he took a lot of heat for that so I feel like he really set the tone against the Knicks early and then obviously had a spectacular game I I think he was the best player on the floor so I think when Kade plays like that you’re going to win a lot of games and I think that’s mostly where my Good Vibes are coming from is that Kade is playing spectacular over the last few games last night’s game the best game kade’s played this season like I’m gonna go yeah just between the efficiency what 15 assists three turnovers the the pullup threes I want to talk about his pull-up threes a little bit because that’s like the shot that kind of separates all the good guards from great guards and just every single time he had space what if they like I don’t like I don’t think they Ed him on screens too much but even you know but he just attacked whatever you know he wasn’t met at the uh screen and like he’s been on a hot Streaker since since he came back from that back injury but yeah I just saw last night and we kind of talked about him a yearli yesterday coup but if you watched last night and you still don’t think Kate is a primary playmaker then I don’t know what to say because he was phenomenal all night real quick cou like he he had 29 last night in 17 shots that has to be one of his more efficient games and to your point Amari it was five of eight from three quite a few of them the pullup variety and I’m glad you mentioned it wasn’t because they were going under it’s because he was using the screen they were getting hung up on it and then he was getting the shot off before they could get there he also got to the free throw line seven times and he made six of them which kayada sneaky not shot well from the free throw line this year he’s actually under 80% even after last night assuming the the stats are updated this morning on bball reference but the 15 assists three turnovers I’ll look at bball reference’s game score for him and see if it was just based on that but what were your thoughts on his game last night coup I thought he was absolutely spectacular again Omar like you mentioned people who think that you should take the ball out of Kay’s hands I’m just going to continue to question like what’s going on but he was spectacular yesterday I I I think it probably I would say probably was his best game of the year maybe I think there’s a there’s two other ones that I think of the game earlier in the season I forget who was let me not let me not speculate I’ll look it up real quick here here let me let me tell you and maybe this so if you just look at game score which is something on bball reference like I’m we don’t have to get into it it has the Wizards game is the second one where he was efficient had a triple double it is the Wizards still the Bucks game is actually the third that’s where he had 35 but on 34 shots the Celtics game is actually fourth he had a really good second half almost had a triple double there Pacers game Bulls Hawks second Pacers game I mean he’s had quite a few good games he’s he’s pretty good at basketball pretty good but he’s okay so I don’t know if any of those were the ones you were thinking of no yeah I thought there was a game earlier in the year when he didn’t necessarily playmake as well but I thought he did I think he scored like 34 or 33 I liked his scoring in that game I did like his overall game against I think you mentioned it the it’s slipping my mind I think it was the Knicks earlier in you the other game against the Knicks or no no no the other game was his other triple double he had against what team was this Atlanta oh yeah the Hawks he had a triple double against the Hawks in a win also yeah I like that game from him as well but yeah this is definitely one of his best games of the year if not the best game of the year he was in that first half was the was maybe the most in control I’ve ever seen Cade of the yeah like he was it’s like he had the the the cheat Cod the test like it was it was crazy he was answering every single defensive coverage everything that that Maks defense do at him he was making the correct read and he kind of spoke about it after the game in the lot room he talks about how he felt like he had the answer to everything the Knicks thre at him he just felt like there was nothing they could do to really stop what he was doing so I thought he looked absolutely spectacular his pull-up threes I’ve been talking about it for two years now that’s the thing that’s going to take him to the next level and this year Jackson Frank tweeted this out he’s shooting 37.2% on pull-up thees so you’ll absolutely take that he’s just about at 40% overall on threes he’s shooting much better even on catch and shoot thees I said it yesterday I think I said it to Amari as well Bryce I think we even hit on it on the podcast last week I’d like to see Kate’s three-point temp even go higher like I I’d like to see him shoot more than six seven a game like let’s get to eight nine 10 a game with how he shooting them I think that would be probably a better way in my opinion for him to reach the efficiency everyone wants him to get to because right now he’s trading a lot of mid-range looks four threes and shots at the rim and even with the shots at The Rim they don’t have to be made field goals he’s trying to get free throws and a lot of times this year it hasn’t translated to free throws and it’s really hurt his efficiency so I wonder if cha trading some of those for threes when he’s shooting like this would help his efficiency even more at least until he starts getting the respect of the whistle West brings up per nba.com over the last six game Kate Cunningham shooting four and a half pullup three-point attempts making two and a half which is 55.6% 50 I don’t think 56% is sustainable but I think four and a half I’m with you I think eight is probably a real number give me four pullup three-point attempts from Cade and I would love to see him get three or four catch and shoot attempts like I I consistently put in my notes that I wish some of these after timeout actions would be designs to get him catch and shoot threes the way they do sometimes for Beasley and Tim Hardway J I think that would be a way to get Kate Cunningham going get him a good look I also want to quickly point out Amari so Kate has played 21 games this year and he has scored 20 or po 20 points or more in 18 of them so like he has been a very assistent scorer 21 games he has 10 or more assists in 12 of those 21 games with a couple more nine assist games and an eight assist game like he has just been very very consistent with the way he scored the ball the way he’s distributed the ball so and I also want to shout out I didn’t think he was a great match up for Brunson a lot of that was the foul trouble stuff like that’s the scary part of putting him on someone like Brunson or we saw it with Jaylen Brown if you want to see a clinic Tape close out he had one last night that was beautiful I believe it was on Duce McBride but he rotated off the ball closed out made two different efforts to cut him off and then the Knicks turned it over Beasley got the box score still but Cade made the play I just think his growth defensively and there’s still room but I think his growth defensively needs to continue to be highlighted because it has been real as well and I’m looking at his consistency just across the board he has not scored fewer than 15 points in any game this season yep he has had as Bobby bucket just mentioned he has 10 plus assists and 11 of his last 14 games and in his last eight games he’s taken at least nine threes in four of those games and at least six and all of them nice in all except one so you’re seeing as the year goes on he’s shooting the ball better he’s shooting more threes his turnovers have been lower he’s dishing more assists like it’s just pretty much been a pretty steady incline I think from week to week when you look at his percentages and his overall efficiency as a passer as well you know what’s crazy Bryce is that you brought that up I had a listener dm’ me this morning I woke up and got this DM it says hey bro been a fan of lockon Pistons fears but I have to tell you this look at the 858 Mark in the fourth quarter and look at the defense Kate played I think it’s the best close out I’ve ever seen Kate have in his career love it so I think you guys might be talking about the same play let me I timestamped it over on the substack so I’m gonna pull it up had multiple that’s even better for K so yeah I kind of hope it’s not the same one right because if it like you said if it’s not the same one what did he he say what Mark the 858 Mark in the fourth quarter no seriously go watch this close out in multiple efforts on McBride at 845 4th quart wait what did he say he said the 858 Mark so it might be that that might be that possession in the fourth quarter though yep yeah so it had to be the same play sometimes sometimes my I don’t worry about the I just get close with the clock but yeah I mean it was really really good stayed in front like I say Beasley got the steal but Cade made the play so I I didn’t intend for this to become kind of the Cade Love Fest I think it’s much deserved any final thoughts on Cade Vibes what needs to happen anything like that before we move on because I think we need to talk Jay iy Jaylen Duran Malik Beasley some of that stuff so coup final thoughts on Kade before we move on to some of those other guys yeah my final thoughts is I Allstar him if he’s not an All-Star I’ll be pretty mad so I mean it’s listen I think it’s he’s finally in the conversation this is the most realistic All-Star they’ve had since we’ve been able to I’ve been able to talk about I shouldn’t say we me and Amari C you’ve been doing this your whole life but like Jeremy Grant I think that first year there was a little bit of a case but I don’t think it was super realistic it’s hard to keep somebody that’s averaging 249 in seven off an All-Star team and here like sadly what’s gonna help him is what’s happened in Orlando like that sucks it really really sucks but yeah Holly Hal Burton not playing well the Orlando guys being hurt the Sixers guys being hurt Maxi not like he’s still getting buckets but that team not winning I think there’s a better chance than maybe what I even thought so it it would be really really cool that would be awesome to see so let’s go to a break because I’m sure as we get into this other stuff we’ll take up plenty of time when we come back Amari your choice we can ask who about Jaylen durren jayen Ivy wherever you want to go you’re up after this break we are back with segment two after talking about Kate in segment one and we’re going to dive into somebody else and I’m looking at coup like like this like how’s like how spicy do we want to go lead off segment to don’t just be I think we should we e into it we’ll ease into it let’s start off with with don’t do that do that him know which one will cause the don’t do that for him this is ridiculous let’s talk about zi real quick talk about talk about softball man this is messed up you’re supposed to give him the change up and see how it goes see if he’ll he’ll take it it’s Sunday it’s Sunday we got to ease into it Bryce we got to ease into it it’s early I mean the fans need something the the best team in the NFL is not playing today they already got their win this week like they they need some spice in in their Sunday no Jaden iy cou Jaden iy all right so so my thoughts on Ivy he’s been better this year 100% he’s this is probably what people expected to see mostly last year from him with Monty but obviously that didn’t happen overall again I want make it clear I think he’s had a good season overall however I think what needs to be I think Omar you me and you talked about this yesterday Bry I think you kind of hinted at it earlier there at some point the Pistons are in year five of the rebuild Cade’s in year four and he’s looking this good at some point we have to have broader discussions without being like a insult like at some point we have to have broader team building discussions because Kade is what 23 right now I’m just gonna stay specific to Jaye Ivy he’s just I think he’s too inconsistent at times and especially when kad’s off the floor they like he was one of the players I talked about yesterday I was a roll coaster there was a four possession spree in the fourth quarter turnover made three turnover made three and it’s just like each time you’re like no yes no yes it’s just like dude like we just I like I’d even take a steady play of just okay like I I take that then like the the mind-breaking turnover and then a great play then a mind like it’s just it’s a roller coaster but he’s been much better this season just a little I think he’s inconsistency has hurt him at times he struggled over the last few games but he hit some big shots yesterday to keep the lead while CER was off the off the floor so that’s big time for him overall I think Pistons fans should be overall pleased with this play but he’s I think I think inconsistency seems to be an issue with him right now so real real quick Amari and then I’ll let you go just looking you know points aren’t everything but we talked about the consistency of kad’s points right so Ivy’s had a season high of 28 that Wizards game was one where both those guys played really well but of his 24 games played he only has eight with 20 or more points and then he has you know what is it seven eight n something like that with 15 or less including two below 10 so what you say that cadow number was 15 this year and they don’t get the same usage but Ivy gets plenty of usage I just the inconsistency is really the thing here and again I think I want to dive into this a little bit more when we get into the broader conversation I think what you said is fair though like it’s very inconsistent and it does like it does matter like that’s important to to notice and talk about so sorry Omari go ahead I just want to get those numbers in real quick no I was going to say it’s been an interesting season for Ji in the sense that you look at his overall numbers that he’s averaging 18 points 45 overall 38 from three you know like almost as many turnovers as assist and that’s you know Pro probably something we would talk about but just scoring wise it’s it’s been it’s been a Leap Forward for him you know I feel like now that we’re 25 games into the season you know it’s like okay he’s kind of figured out the scoring aspect of it to an extent I thought it was really big for him to hit those two threes late that you know New York’s pushing trying to you know complete the comeback and both of those those threes were just daggers right because the 16-point lead in today’s NBA is probably what you know a nine-point lead used to be like 10 years ago and they helped them stay on top like you’re seeing those bmus that grow from him as a shooter that I like I think it’s just the playmaking aspect that you still want to see a little bit more of I thought he had some really nice passes in the first half playing next to Kate but you saw the game shift in that third quarter when you know Kate had four fouls he took a rest and you know the offense just kind of stagnated so I know we’re going to get into that aspect of it later but that’s one thing I do want to see from ji this season is at the very least to cut out the turnovers right you know I think you could be that secondary playmaker the team needs you don’t have to be Chris paw like if you just cut out the Nary turnovers I think that’s more than half of it right there and you know I I think for this season to be of true success for him that’s his next area is to cut those turnovers out real quick who Wes says he also has three games with six or more turnovers and six games with two or less turnovers just to continue with this roller coaster of of what we get from him so I know you had a thought but I wanted to get that in real quick no yeah I mean that’s just really why I’m at with Ivy is that over all are you cool with what he’s done this year yeah but it’s just been it’s it’s been high and then it’s been low and it’s just it literally goes possession to possession it’s not just him it’s the other player that Omar was going to ask about but it’s it’s high low high low it’s just possession to possession it’s crazy but overall yes I I agree with you Omar his scoring has been much better this year crazy enough his finishing still isn’t where you’d expect it to be yeah that’s a good point too his finishing still is not the greatest but his shooting has been better from Beyond The Arc he still draws a decent amount of free throws for the usage that he has so that keeps it level somewhat levelheaded but I mean yeah I I think Ivy’s been fine this year just inconsistent and really I think he’s been struggling over the last week and a half or so too yeah I mean definitely with this guy I want to see the whole year right the the next guy we’re going to talk about maybe some people have already lost patience ji has shown enough Improvement especially after how last year started where like that that was just crazy you know emotionally mentally for him I’m willing to see also for everybody who always says Benedict Maan and Shaden sharp I get it I think we would have some worries about those guys if they were in Detroit as well like I think they would be getting the same criticism I’m not saying they wouldn’t be better fits couldn’t be better fits and I was a huge mathine guy Benedict Maan has a negative assist to turnover ratio and isn’t good defensively shanon sharp is shooting 28% from three right now now he did come of the Year hurt only 15 games all of that but even as a career he has a lower three-point percentage than jayen Ivy all I’m saying is I think we’re quick to say those two names and I’m not saying they might not be a little bit better but I don’t think that they’re perfect in the way that we think sometimes and I love Benedict Maan I know you were a huge shayon sharp guy C I’m not saying that Shaden sharp wouldn’t be better I’m just saying it’s not like that was light years better based off what we’ve seen thus far it may still prove to be that I just don’t know that that’s like it’s just a crazy like this would 100% be it we’ll talk about what we think ji’s perfect role is whenever we get to the end of the episode and even maybe what that means for his contract I want to go ahead and throw the change up here and see where we can get you Jaylen durren coup Jaylen durren where are we at what are your thoughts man cuz listen you I want to give a real quick caveat with Jaylen dur everybody’s talking about him getting beat in transition right he gets smoked in transition fouls gives up the N1 then doesn’t box out for whatever reason on the free throw essentially gives up four points I do want to point out Isaiah Stewart got outran by Ariel hook porty later in the game as well so it duren’s not the only one that it happened to last night I just want to give that quick caveat but not Duran’s best performance where are you at is he growing anywhere more patience what do you I I can’t I’m not going to lie to you guys I’m getting pretty close to just being like I’m I’m done like I’m the crazy thing is is I don’t want to be done because he did he threw me a solid and shouted me out so I appreciate he did me a solid so I don’t want to be but it’s it’s becoming harder and harder and harder for me to realistically say you shouldn’t be like done yesterday Bryce I’m telling you this right now you as a coach I just I I want to know what your reaction would have been I was pissed no no no not not even just like not it’s not the fact that he got beat on the box out he didn’t step in it’s the fact he he was he just didn’t move like he just like he just straight up I would have called a timeout and subbed him out like that would have been my reaction and whether I mean if it was Kade I would have done the same thing you can’t miss the box out after you got beat in transition coup you can’t do it here’s the other thing everybody remembers that play there was one earlier in the game where his man is jogging back on offense and so he’s just jogging back on defense it’s Jericho Sims at half court line he’s not a threat there Kade gives up a drive which he shouldn’t have but because Duren joged back on defense he wasn’t there to help on the drive he should have been back and ready to help so it’s even things like that where I don’t even think he recognizes it he won’t be there whenever it’s a floor spacing big in transition but when it’s Jericho freaking SS he decides he wants to stand at the three-point line I just it’s like it’s not clicking man you know what I mean it’s not clicking cou I don’t know what look so I I’ve said this now about one of the concerns about durren has been like last year for example I saw a lot of Pistons fans and I get it but I saw a lot of Pistons fans comparing him like to to Drummond young Drummond when he first was drafted the Pistons super raw guy 18 years old both of them super young etc etc and I said last year the difference is and Omari I don’t know were you a Beat riter by the time Drummond you weren’t a beat writer yet right you were after right I started like right after they traded Drummond so like my first day was like April 6 2020 or something like that so like right in the pandemic hit were you in Memphis yet by the time I was in Memphis Yeah okay but Drummond Drummond showcased flashes and was much more impactful already as a 19-year-old defensively whereas durren he just I don’t feel like there’s ever been more than like a two to three game stretch where he’s legitimately like flashed defensively whenever I think about uh Drummond just while I’m thinking about it right now he stole the ball from Dwayne Wade on back-to-back position it was late in a game but I just always think about that like his hands were so quick and the feet were so quick that he got two consecutive rips on Dwayne weight but just to your point about seeing those those flashes coup about seeing the ability Drummond’s Drummond’s hands defensively were quick as hell like it was so they were so fast that Stan Van Gundy built an entire defense around him playing aggressively in the pick and roll because he created turnovers and all that kind of thing so while Drummond My overall point getting to this was that Drummond flashed those things young and you were like okay he he’ll be able to do this I feel like and correct me if you guys disagree but I feel like for three years it’s mostly been just wishful thinking like there hasn’t been much shown on the court to believe that he’s going to be good defensively that he’s going to improve defensively it’s mostly been well he’s athletic he has long arms he’s you know he he he should be able to do these things and when we haven’t really seen him do it consist like consistently for more than like maybe a game or two so the the the play Yesterday Bryce was enough for me like I like there’s been not only that box out but the I don’t know if you guys know but the offensive possession before he did that Euro Step like the Pistons the Pistons were starting to lose ground and he just took a a play from the high post area just tried to drive in and and Euro EUR uh Euro Step and missed the floater and then immediately comes back down and and does what does that like that was enough for me to be like look you can’t play the rest of the game bro like you just you you just cannot come back on the floor after that like it’s just there’s too many stretch is like that where it’s just like I’m close to just being completely out and I don’t want to be because he’s only 21 but it’s like at some point it can’t just be wishful thinking at some point you got to give something on tape for me to like build around and you’re just like you’re not doing that okay real quick Mari I know you got thoughts we got to get to but real quick first I want you guys to answer this for me think about it and I’ll I’m gonna give some stats that Wes put in the chat how many times do you think this year Duran has had back-to-back games with double digit rebounds so that’s my question you guys have answer when backtack games with double digit rebounds hold on Drummond year one averaged 2.6 stocks year two 2.8 stocks year three 2.8 stocks Duren threeyear 1.6 1.3 1.7 so to your point just not as disruptive okay how many times this year has Duren had back-to-back games with double digit rebounds I know his rebounds are down and typically he has a double digit rebound streak going and I can’t think of any significant good on he’s had this season so I’m going to say I’m going to say two I’m GNA say two like you know you know you know how inditing this is you know you know how bad this this is a question how much how many can you guess and say two as well it is two the answer should be like 12 it should have been 12 straight so since we’ve done this on the Pod and it it wasn’t like intended we looked at the point consistency of Cade versus the point consistency of Ivy how about the rebound consistency of Jaylen Duran who had a 22 rebound game in a game where he gave up a bunch of points but nonetheless and then has had a four rebound game and yes minutes vary a little bit but he’s only had nine games where he had double digit rebounds this year and I believe this would be 10 or 11 where he’s had less than double digit rebounds it just to to to back up your point there’s two games that really just cannot happen with the rebounding Department the first one is that game against the Hornets against what is it diab body oh yeah yeah ending to that game all the talk was oh the Pistons should dominate The Glass Duran should really be great at the end this one they don’t have Mark like all this stuff and he gets like they just got out outplayed by diabat and then the second game just a few games ago he had the same amount of rebounds as pay Pritchard pay briard is nice though he is nice he’s nice but he’s not drumming with the glass he shouldn’t have the same the other day Kade had to have the most rebounds on the team against Boston and he had the same amount of rebounds as pay Pritchard like that just like those things cannot be things uttered out my mouth it just can’t happen not when you’re not a when you’re not a stretch big and you’re not very good protecting the rim you have to dominate somewhere and he’s not doing it in the area where he was at one point Sorry Amari get your thoughts off here because no I mean you guys mostly hit on it but that’s the the conversation that always comes that we always come back to with Duren is uh to be a modern big you know if you’re not shooting then you have to dominate the paint and Def L you have to either be a true rim protector or a guy who can like roam you know like you’ve got to be one or the other and I think most bigs have a hybrid of either just being Elite run protectors or you could just kind of allow them to do whatever and maybe have some you know strength behind them but guys like jiren and EV Moy you know like you got to be able to do one of those two rows and duren’s just not there yet so you know you’re sort of in a weird an awkward spot where it’s like yes he’s 21 but he’s also in year three you know you have extension talks with him Ivy next summer and then you have one more year essentially to figure out is there somebody we could build around or do you move on so especially with a new coaching staff a new front office you know this isn’t the group that drafted him right this is the group that brought him in that you know initially saw the potential so you know he’s he’s one of the players I’m keeping an eye on really just through the rest of this season not necessarily from a like a a transaction trade standpoint or anything but just worse so like he’s probably the one of the guys at the top of the list of we have to make a decision at some point on if he’s going to be part of the future or not and again so much of that for him just comes down to what he is or isn’t doing on defense real quick want to shout out Roy busik watching on Facebook good family friend here so I always appreciate the the personal connections whenever they connect on Facebook before we go to break I want to ask this to both of you what’s the answer well we’re gonna get big picture at next segment we can talk trades what’s more important all of that it’s going on in the chat right now I love it no trade you can’t say trade for a center let’s just say they keep the big man position as is C Amari what do you do do you continue to start him and say hey you’re either going to figure this out or it’s going to continue you’re G to continue to be the topic of every Pistons episode until you figure it out do you start Stu do you start Paul Reed for a few games let Stu stay on the bench and and bench Duren for a few games and see if that sends a message where are you at on that pendulum right now coup of what you would do you can’t just trade him or trade for an upgrade right now in this scenario I think you have to Su him I I think I’m start at this point I’m starting Su I I have the concern of Stu’s finally found his role as a backup five and he’s thriving in it but you could make a legitimate argument and it’s one that I would agree with and someone commented this in the chat like having a better starting center would be more impactful than going at and getting like a bi I agree with that like it’s gotten to a point where you could legitimately make the argument Duren is costing them games like he is he his play at the five position is losing them games and it again I said this to to Omari on the last podcast that I don’t think it would be as big of a deal or noticed as much if it wasn’t this big of an immediate change as soon as he leaves the floor as soon as he leaves the floor and Stu comes in it’s literally like what I think I said to him already last episode it was like 17 point swing from when Stu comes on the court with the same starters to when duren’s playing with them like you just like it can’t be that drastic of a swing and and continue to have him starting if you if you are you’re letting everyone know and maybe people are fine with this but you’re letting everyone know that you’re valuing trying to develop him over trying to win as many many games as possible right now yeah by bball references onof he has the worst onoff outside of Tim Hardaway Jr and you know ji’s a negative Holland’s a negative fonio is a negative but you know his is negative 5.2 Isaiah Stewart’s is 1.6 and you know Cades is the well Beasley is the best actually but yeah it’s interesting I I kind of like this from Bobby buckets St a saw and stew instead of thj and Duran use aaar in those creative ways I’ve always said if you’re going to play aard pairing in with stew you both know how I feel about starting stew I feel like then the fan base is gonna hate him because he’s not the starting center they want but I think Wes says start Paul Reed for a week keep stew on the bench and see if that truly sends a message it’s like like hey you’re going to take a week off if you need to rest get your legs back whatever here’s your chance Omari same question to you you can’t make a trade we’re not doing that right now we can talk about that after the break are where are you at would you continue to start him would is it time for a message what do you think what would you do if you’re in JB’s shoes right now yeah I mean you have Paul Reed who you know was good enough to start you know gains played all 82 for a good Sixers team last year you know we’ve seen Paul Reed in limited minutes you know he knows how to play you know he knows where to be on defense you know he’s about to be a good backup center we know what Isaiah Stewart can do you know so if you have the guys on the the roster then to be that’s just a real realation adjustment you make you know there’s really no reason to have a guy like P Reed if you know you you you need a par re and you’re not playing them right so you know I would just call Par Reed’s number you know maybe just start stew and go from there but again I think the other combo with durren is obviously winning games this season while also finding opportunities for development and I don’t think you need to play during 30 minutes a night for him to De develop he can still find minutes here and there but if you have guys who are getting it done and it’s just a simple question of that then to me that’s pretty straightforward yeah I mean that’s an interesting idea too we see some teams where a guy gets to start and you know he plays the first four minutes of the game and then he sits he starts the second half plays four minutes and then kind of maybe maybe it’s just really limiting the minutes and getting a true three-man rotation with Paul Reed we’re going to go to break when we come back I’ll put the question I would like to start up on the screen Amari we’ll start there because I think it’ll really drive the rest of the conversation but we’ll get to that right after [Music] [Music] this all right we are back with segment three and Bryce I believe you’re going to te us off with a question here yeah so from colen wood Pistons Twitter is always talking about a bi trade and upgraded Center would be much more impactful in my opinion so we guys we are going to go we’re going to go big picture now okay coup go wherever you want with it I know you started to with ji Amari same thing we listen we’re 25 games into the season I think all of three of us are in a similar page we’re like this has been good for our expectations we like the Vibes I don’t think it’s unfair to start look at what the next steps are we we feel like we’re starting to get some real data on who Kate is who ji is who JD is how this team could look if you have real scores real floor spacing that type of stuff and quite honestly a week from today guys the tread de trade deadline kind of opens up guys become available so this is going to be part of the conversation around the NBA this specifically coup where do you I think this is the two biggest needs which one do you think is more important for the near future Etc I think getting it I think the easiest way to get more wins is an upgraded Center I think that would immediately translate to more wins having somethingone that can impact the team defensively I mean again like I said I mean it’s it’s that big of a difference when just stew is on the floor I don’t think anyone thinks Stu is like a starting center right now so like I think that’s the quickest way to get immediate wins but at some point what I was trying to what I was saying earlier was you at some point you gotta have these broad discussions you got you have to go beyond just I mean kade’s in year four Kade is 23 years old and we’re seeing him play the best basketball of his career we’re seeing him continue to take the next steps at some point you C you have to at some point it can’t be about evaluation and patience at some point you have to go out and actually try to win games you actually have to try to go out and take that next step and I think you can’t do that unless you feel good about your main guy and I think everyone feels good about Cade I think he’s playing the best game or best basketball of his career right now on both sides of the floor you have to do something like you have at some point you have to make a deal you H or not make a deal you have to do something to get that that second guy with Cade I think that’s maybe most important for me if you go across and you just look at all the other young guys across the league I think it happens I mean you can name whoever once they that team feels like okay this guy’s here he’s enough we need to they go out and get somebody whether it’s Tyrese with uh uh Pascal Pascal whether it’s Devon Booker getting CP3 whether it’s you go go across all the I mean honestly the Knicks just did this with Brunson right once they felt like they had Brunson they started now they went all in you know to the extreme but the same idea yeah I mean I it’s just everywhere across the league once you feel good about your young guy and you think he’s here you go and get somebody you go and get a legitimate guy who doesn’t have to be better than him maybe he is better but at least on his level creation wise at least on his level impact wise so you can start having a chance in these games right now I I feel like I don’t want to go too far into this gu I don’t know if you want to bring it up later no no let’s go we’re we’re all in wherever it goes ji and J Jaylen dur I think are giving you a pretty clear picture in my opinion of what they are I think Jaylen durran without some massive change it’s it’s he’s not going to rute much to winning right now is it’s not going to happen Jay and Ivy I think is showing that he’s made these steps as as a scorer as a shooter however do you want him is he someone you want as your two or do you want him to be like your third fourth scorer do you want him to be that six-man Off the Bench as just a pure scorer I think Ivy has clearly carved himself a role for the Pistons right like out of all the players I think he’s carved himself a roll at the Pistons doesn’t mean he’s like Untouchable if you can trade him to get like a superstar obviously no one’s untouchable but he’s I think he’s the one that’s cleared up and carved his role with this team that you can feel good about you can put him in situations you know where he can Thrive at and he can help you win games outside of that you need somebody who can be that second guy with Cade and I think that needs to be priority number one at some point especially like you mentioned it earlier Bryce if you if you do go the route of okay we’re just gonna continue to start Jaylen durren because we’re worried about development what do you what’s that saying to Cade who’s playing like winning basketball who is playing well enough for them to win games and try to fight for this playin if you’re just going to send the message of well we’re not really worried about winning we’re just trying to develop again like it’s year four at some point he’s gonna get he’s gonna get tired of this he’s gonna get tired of hearing winning doesn’t matter we’re just trying to develop like at some point you get enough data to know look we got we gota move forward we we have to take the next step at some point I I think Kate has pushed this thing forward I agree with you I think the idea of do you go all in on the number two option right now or the stretch big or whatever is interesting because I think I agree with you and Cliff and cleans kettle ball says J ji is not ever going to be a legit number two I I don’t want to say ever but I think we’ve seen quite a bit that I don’t feel as strongly about that as I did at one time I think I put it in my notes somewhere that I think probably is the number three type of guy like your third starter and then maybe still kind of run a bench unit maybe that’s what he ends up being a real number two scorer maybe number one score depending on what you how you want to frame it whatever is what the team needs Kade playing this finally seeing it for this amount of time pushes things forward Amari which do you think do you think they need to go get that number two score do you wait and see if Holland shows more if assar shows more if ji shows more or is is it the center position where it doesn’t look like they have a legitimate starting center right now oras people brought up with Miles Turner who is an unrestricted free agent this offseason it I don’t think that’s as crazy of a possibility as what you may think cuz Indiana is in disarray right now is that more of the play where where are you at between those two things I’m a little bit in the middle cool we did talk about a little bit on X last week where you know there’s so much talk and even on your pod yesterday like there’s so much talk about veteran PG this and that and really it’s just like you look at the Milwaukee game right like they had yis sandan like that’s what you need it’s not veteran point guard it’s another guy that strikes fear to the heart of defenses right the Pistons are at that point I don’t think it’s a point where you need to solve it this season per se only because one there’s a pretty good draft next year you know so I don’t think you necessarily need to take yourself out of the running for that unless you’re essentially where the Pacers where where where it’s like where we’re going to make the playoffs anyway so we might as well try to make that leap from playoff team to Contender right you know I think the pisses are somewhere in between those two zones but after this season if you feel pretty firmly that Cunningham is your one guy then at that point and we’ve talked about it on the princess post a lot Bryce but it’s just consolidating at that point right like we know that we want Kate like he’s already under a max deal we’re gonna build around him you know you have guys like Ron Holland assar you know you Sasser those guys have time you don’t need to make a decision about them you know this season or even next summer right they still have a few years to develop and whatnot you know becomes a little bit more pressing with guys like Ivy and Duran where it’s you know are these guys who can potentially contribute to winning down the road yes but do you make Financial commitments to players who you know probably more so looking like roog guy ceilings and I think that’s the debate you probably have going into the trade deadline do you consolidate now or do you wait till the offseason to make those moves and I think a lot of that just comes down to where they are record-wise if they’re still in a 33 win Pace at the deadline I’m not making that trade in February I’m going wait till the summer if you’re at a 40 win Pace then okay maybe you make the trade then because you don’t want to be in that weird spot of oh like we you know we’re in the lottery but we also lost in the playin right going to maximize your eyes to actually get into the playoffs at that point so it comes down to record and if we actually in the month or a month and a half I probably have a much firmer idea but you’re at the point where that’s a real conversation you start to have right now for sure so C I want to you don’t have to give me a name we’ve all talked about the names but I see people saying like yeah we need to do this the Pistons need to do this but bi costs too much Zack LaVine costs too much this guy doesn’t makes sense like what is the ideal archetype then like let’s say let’s say ji is at least in the plans right ji assar is obviously in the plans you know Ron Holland somewhere in there because I do think those guys are important for your defensive into the floor assar and Ron Holland but I think a big time score helps hopefully ji continue to improve defensively we talked about kad’s defensive Improvement and eventually you get better at the center position what is the what what is the guy what does that look like I kind of thought like what we saw from Malik Beasley last night makes a lot of sense I am more interested in a volume floor spacer like that not necessarily Beasley but a volume floor spacer off ball bucket getter then I am other guy that comes in and handles the ball as much I don’t think they need a guy that takes the ball out of kade’s hands as much as others do I think I’m in the minority there but I think Kade does it a lot ji can do it a little I still think assar is gonna be able to do a little bit where would you be in terms of just the archetype of player well it sounds like that you are without actually doing it sounds like you’re taking probably the two most popular options and putting them both in the bucket that you were describing if you want the volume score you’re probably looking at LaVine if you’re looking at someone who’s going to take the ball out of their hands a little more you’re probably looking at bi okay so okay so Stephen P says clay like Clay is the name I thought of this morning but there’s not very many Clays but yes that idea so let’s take money out of the equation injuries out of the equation would you rather add bi to this team or Zack LaVine to this team if we’re just taking money out the equation I want everyone who’s W listening to this because people come at me on Twitter all the time when it’s like well you’re not talking about the money we’re taking money out we’re we’re Tak money out looking for we’re looking for an archetype because everybody likes to say they need no you can’t say neither one because we’re taking money out guys we all like to say they need a second score and then we say well this guy doesn’t work that guy doesn’t work guys we’re taking Health out it’s all out all we’re looking for is the archetype of player that’s all I’m asking get my list out because I have a list of players that are too good for P for the Pistons because here’s the other thing people keep bringing up Nas Reed does Nas is n Reed the second like is he the second option on a contender I don’t know that he is as much as I love him so again very much clarifying for the final time archetype only no injuries those sliders are off the salary cap is off what is the archetype between a Brandon Ingram verse a Zack LaVine that you think makes the most sense I’d be I’d be fine with either archetype because I see the argument for both I I I completely agree with what you’re saying Bryce and you’ve been on this I think for a while now about the Cade needs another guy who’s just going to be score next to him yes yes I completely get that so I’m not I’m not opposed to that either I think that is I can see both I tend to lean a little bit more towards bi I’d like to I I want there to be a volume score but I want to trust the playmaking with the ball in your hands as well I want to trust that you can make the right read and that you have that play those playmaking chops and I think bi is really underrated as a playmaker so I would take I would go that route however like having a guy like LaVine who can just pop off for 40 like any given night and just like go on a heater of like six straight threes after like being off the entire night like you know how much the Pistons would die to have a guy like line do what they did against the Pistons like it’s a close game all throughout he’s struggling throughout the game then the fourth quarter he just hits six straight threes like it’s just like they don’t have someone that can just do that so I I’d say either one but i’ I’d like to I tend to lean more towards bi because I like the playmaking having more playmaking with it I think that’s fair I would take the Zack LaVine archetype I always thought that was the best archetype and I still would stay there I what I like about bi is the size that that would add to the lineup compared to adding a LaVine so I’m cool with it again Cliff we’re talking archetypes I’m not talking about what we’ve actually seen bi do in the playoffs versus Zack LaVine in the play like just archetype of player I would go Zack LaVine archetype of player a little bit over bi but I think I’m still on I don’t want to take the ball completely out of ji’s hands and I don’t want to take the ball completely out of assar Thompson’s hands and that’s why I’m a little more okay with LaVine you know that type of player Amari same question again for all the listeners archetype only Amari because you’ll really get aggregated like people will be commenting on your your articles and everything like that just crushing you yelling you at LCA about what you said LaVine archetype Brandon Ingram archetype I would go LaVine and I’ll thr out that last season around the trade deadline it was some fake trade somebody pitched it was like what you LaVine and Caruso for ji and like Sasser and I was like yes yes like slam the button and everybody was like no and now I’m like if you look at it now like LaVine and and Kusa on this team like this is a clear playoff team like easy you know but LaVine I just like that archetype like just a guy who could really heat up from three in a hurry plus athlete like can handle some of the playmaking aspects you know like I just think his game fits Kade perfectly I don’t necessarily want a guy who’s going to like split ball handling reps with Kade per se I guess like you know if the b in bi’s hands the b in bi’s hands like I don’t know if he’s playing off Kade as much but LaVine like a guy who’s always going to be a threat where he’s at on the floor I like I like the idea of the the venix to Kate a lot so that’s the archetype I’m going with to the comments earlier this is the Benedict Ma and Shaden sharp argument right I feel like is the Zack LaVine archetype of player like those guys just obviously haven’t been at his level yet they are still very young I just think it’s I think it’s really fun to to think about I think we all agree on one thing this team needs the second dude now when do we think Raichu like you may think it needs to happen at the trade deadline I may be a little bit more comfortable waiting till the off season let me ask you this how would you feel if they signed a stop Gap version of that what if they just said I don’t think CJ is still playing quite at the level to be this but what if they brought in I don’t know whoever CJ McCullum like is Anthony Simons isn’t having a great year either do you think it needs to be the guy that can grow with Cade or is it okay if they just went and got somebody like hey this is going to be a couple because I bring this up this offseason LaVine only has this bad contract for two more years I was literally just looking that up on my computer because people come about stop gaps I feel like LaVine could be like when people talk about you trade for LaVine you’re screwed for five years you’re really not not anymore yeah he only has two years left on that deal after this year so like he could be that stop cap and the contract ends he has a player option when he turns 31 so you’re getting out of it before he turns like you know he’s reaching the end of his prime before he hits 33 that’s why I’ve been on the LaVine train I don’t view it as a I don’t I and I’m I’ll separate myself from Bry Omar I want make sure you guys don’t get screwed over with this I’m not talking about archetype in this comment right here I’m talking about ax LaVine archetype is over actual player Contract Health everything real World back to the real world I would take LaVine because I I do view him as a stop Gap I think like I had a Philadelphia fan on my podcast this or last summer and he spoke about how with the Sixers they went out and paid a lot of money to JJ reick but it was for a two threee span it it was it was it was extremely it was an expensive contract but it was to soak up that it was to soak up the cap space for that two to threee span help take the team to that next level during that time and then you get out of it quick and what happened during that time I mean JJ played the best basketball his career the Sixers probably played the best basketball career with or of their time with embiid and Simmons they were fantastic and then you got out of their contract after that and then after you get out the stop Gap you have an idea of okay this works these guys got this much better we need to go get this and now we have the cast space to go do it so that’s why I’ve been on there with LaVine he only has two years left after it you’re not stuck with him forever and the Pistons are not screwed cap wise you get that stop cap you see what he does for Cade where does he take Cade to heck where does he even maybe take Ivy to whatever where is he take these players to how how much better can this team get during these two years with him and then after that you know you have much Clear answers and what the next step is after that for this team Stephen P says what comes after the stop Gap uh you trade all your draft picks again because at that time you would have access to all of them that pick would be reconciled I know it’s scary but we would be year six of Kade Cunningham at that point you would know exactly what you have in ji JD assar Holland what other pick I know people asked about Bobby Clinton Marcus Sasser Stu all of those guys then LaVine you either just let him go in free agency use him as the trade money in that trade and you trade three picks to go get whoever that Devin Booker whoever you know whoever it is on the market at that point I don’t think it’s ideal I think it’s an interesting idea though to get that stop Gap guy to you know show all of these things I just want to ask you guys I want to ask you a question real quick so do you guys believe that if you were to have tried to get LaVine last year versus trying to get him from the Bulls now do you think the price has gone up or down up up for sure okay yeah because they were like they were trying to get off of that money last year and now he’s like a a great contract he guys he’s been really good like say whatever you want about injuries and all of that he’s 51 4380 right now and he’s averaging 4.3 assists to 2.7 turnovers he’s like trying defensively he’s not a good defensive player like we understand that but he’s very good right now so if he plays this whole year it’s definitely up so that’s a good point Stephen that you may have some issues there did this just come out I I think it happened last night oh okay people are saying sorry for audio listeners that bi sidelined indefinitely according to Shams I would be surprised if he plays again before the dead bi needs to get traded before the deadline because he’s an unrestricted free agent and not a whole lot of cap space out there so uh if if if you want be on the Pistons the next couple months so where were you going to go with that in terms of lavine’s trade value up and down my point was is that I feel like people I feel like people don’t don’t take the these things into account and they play scared and I don’t think that you want your GM to play scared my point in saying that is players values are lower no one wants them no fans want to trade for them they’re trash stay away from them you don’t want them and then when they value go when they start playing like how you usually like did anyone actually think LaVine wasn’t going to be good like did anyone actually think LaVine wasn’t gonna get back to where like he was no but his value was low people were talking bad about his contract which is is it is expensive he’s overpaid but he was it happens all across the league when their players value is low no one wants them then when the value goes back up now it’s like oh well go get them well now you can’t get them now you can’t get him because his value went up it’s the same like I think people need to understand and it goes back to my com conversation I had all offseason like you’re kind of starting to see this play out with durren that if you have to take a it’s a risk either way you have to take the risk that you feel most comfortable with the risk like with Duren I was in the offseason saying I would trade one of them during our Ivy now Ivy’s improved so maybe it would have been bad to trade Ivy but Duren trade one of them because if you let them play out the risk is okay maybe they do get better and then their value goes higher or we’re talking after 25 games sit him and now and and and bench him and now his value is completely shot it’s the same thing with players like LaVine like a maybe even a Zion if he were to become available like these players who you know they’re really good their value is low that is the window of opportunity for a team like the Pistons who don’t have crazy assets they don’t have crazy picks that’s your window of opportunity to get a guy at low value and let him play it out with you and get high value but if you just wait till everyone’s at high value you’ll never get any of these players you just it just won’t ever happen real quick Mel says but it’s different for bad teams that aren’t asset Rich isn’t it Mel I appreciate you in the chat I feel like you’re you’ve been very like I know you’re taking a different side of this and I love it I was like I think even more so because they aren’t asset Rich they have to take a chance and it is scary as heck I get it I understand it but eventually they have to do it what were you gonna say Amari yeah I was just going to say by acquiring Zach LaVine last season either you get him essentially for free and just absorb C money or you get some sort of asset to take them and that was another reason why I like that deal for the Pistons last year for getting them for that price because when you need assets but two the absolute worst case scenario was that you get a pretty good player who’s hurt that becomes an expiring the season after next where you’re probably not going to be a contender anyway so you know it’s like oh milk now but in hindsight it looks like that would have been a move that could have paid off for him Mel says I don’t know reminds me of getting Blake Griffin Omari says lack of fear got us you know these guys with injury like I get it again I’m just saying the one thing is you have to be smarter right like you got to be careful with these injury guys I get that it would depend on what the I don’t know what it’ll take to get Zack in this offseason like that’s the other thing if you told me they had to trade their two future picks or you know whatever then I now you don’t do it so I’m the other guy is Andrew Wiggins like I think I was on an island saying I would buy low on Andrew Wiggins last year at the deadline he’s having a pretty good year this year but I mean guys like he could have been awful still so I mean it is it is what it is so yeah good point Wes the the Pistons fans hate the Griffin deal but you also hate the draft NES so you know which one defended the the Blake deal cuz I’m like you never get a player of Blake’s caliber in free agency so that’s a worthwhile deal to make they just had horrible injury luck which happens but I I’ve always defended that trade as well I’m with Omari too I’ve always defended that though obviously it didn’t end up working out on the end I’ve always didn’t work out I’ve always defended that decision okay last thing here and then we’ll get you guys out any updates on Bobby Clinton I know I know people were asking theyve the team just subscribed as like a weird issue where he had fluid with his calf and like he’s literally been walking around and everything it’s not like it like it’s just been like a weird recovery so I wish I had more than that like it doesn’t sound like it’s an inherently really serious issue at this point but you know Cavs are are weird and they’ve just given an extra sign to heal all right guys if you were here live thank you so much the chat was popping we truly appreciate it again I always appreciate like you guys respectfully have conversations you provide stuff to the the podcast all of that even if we don’t agree or your Point’s a little bit different we love it we appreciate you make sure you like subscribe follow all of that make sure you’re reading Amari on the Free Press make sure you’re subscribed to the Motor City Hoops substack where I put out game notes and Analysis and will start to do NBA draft stuff down the road when it’s a little bit closer and then of course thanks to C QT says it Elite guest I feel bad for Wes because I knew the outline was just going to get it was there was no chance we were following the outline today I call it West listen when I go on lock on who gets in trouble because I talk too much and we go too long when cou comes on the Pistons pulse he gets in trouble because we don’t follow the outline so oh yes Omari we got some family drama Mr Sova says my son my son the Griffin deal will always be a sore spot between us I love it all right to my Dad’s credit he didn’t like the deal from the moment it happened so I sounds like Christmas dinner is going to be very interesting to at the St kofla house no this is old hat now this is old hat Griffin doing podcast on YouTube we’re past it co let them know where they can find you and then we’ll get everybody everybody on with their Sunday you guys can find me over on Twitter at caill you can also find me over on what is it blue sky now on also @ caill you also find locked on Pistons whatever podcast platform you’re listening to us on also you can find us over on YouTube locked on Pistons also subscribe to my personal YouTube channel at cill as well I do want to say to you Bryce real quick Mel mentioned in the chat he doesn’t think the Celtics would do a deal like that they literally did it last year with Chris Al porzingis all right Omari take it away my guy all right big thanks to our audio producer Robin Chan editor and chief Nico Avery Nichols and big shout out to us Davenport as always we’ll make sure he gets the Pistons Post in the YouTube next week and we also talk to youall next week so thanks for tuning in

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