📅 Published on: 2024-12-13 19:03:06

⏱ Duration: 00:29:38 (1778 seconds)

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📝 Video Description:

Sahadev Sharma and Patrick Mooney of The Athletic run down what they heard in Dallas during one of baseball’s signature events.

It all starts with Kyle Tucker and a potential deal with the Astros, but the Cubs are active on several fronts. With the price of pitching soaring, there’s a breakdown of what a Justin Steele contract extension might look like, and an explanation of why the Cubs are seriously in the Roki Sasaki sweepstakes.

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🎙 Channel: North Side Territory

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🕵️‍♂️ Transcript:

[Music] welcome into Northside territory foul territory Network’s Cubs podcast I’m sahad Sher with my partner Patrick Mooney we’re your Cubs beat writers over at the athletic Patrick the winter meetings have wrapped up uh what was that four nights of little sleep but a lot of rumors uh it was it it was I don’t know if you could say there was a lot of movement uh as far as the Cubs went there just there weren’t there like nothing went official uh during those days there but uh to suggest the tenor hasn’t changed would be a mistake I think right like no doubt yeah very different feeling from a week ago uh about things around the Cubs wano has signed and as expected at least the talk has heated up um and right now it feels like we’re in weit mode right like Kyle Tucker they’re not just rumors There’s real stuff going on teams are talking the Cubs are not just uh one or two people talking about it it’s they are it sounds like the leader for Kyle Tucker if Kyle Tucker is getting traded uh a lot of people have already said it’s it’s the Cubs the Yankees are in on it our colleague Ken rosenal wrote about how the Yankees should step up their price will they would the Astros want to trade Kyle Tucker to a team that is often their you know uh competition to get into the World Series uh I think that’s a valid uh point to bring up um but I do wonder is this getting to a point where Cubs fans have their hopes so high that if it doesn’t happen uh there’s going to be you know Defcon what is it is it higher DEFCON 5 is is the worst thing Defcon five Twitter meltdowns I think you you allude to this before we started recording like Defcon Jake peave right I loved like uh the history lesson here of where is Kyle tuer gonna be what are some of those other names when you think back on like Cubs Pursuits the perfect guy and just didn’t happen right it I like I think of Jake pey and I think of Brian Roberts like those guys were supposed to Rafael forall is another name that pops up in my mind um we didn’t have Twitter back then if I’m yeah no there was no Twitter uh back in those days so like I remember following it I on message boards of all things uh searching for rumors uh waiting for the next radio update or or notes column in in the Tribune or whatever it may be to try and get any semblance of an idea of what’s going on now it’s minute to minute right like people are like uh uh dissecting every tweet that comes out par ing every word what does it mean um often times I I would I would say that uh not a lot of thought is going through uh the tweeters uh the people sending out the Tweet like maybe when they write a story there’s more Nuance to it but i’ I’d be careful parsing every word of a tweet Cubs fans that all that said yes if this doesn’t happen for the Cubs we we’ I think we’ve gotten to that point where where it’s uh they won’t be able to accept it they won’t this will not go well uh the the expectation for Cubs fans has already become that Kyle Tucker will be on on the on this team come opening to so I I don’t I don’t love that for Cubs fans because it it’s like these things are like someone texted me they they asked like is this gonna happen this is a friend who’s a fan is this gonna happen I said listen and and I think Jed kind of said this too and I I’ve said this for I don’t know how long basically since I’ve covered the game and just talking to people people so many trades come and go right so many things get talked about and which is also why we’re very hesitant to put out rumors until we feel very you know strongly about it um exactly these things come and go like trades are really hard to pull off when someone asks me like do you think the Cubs can trade for this guy I I’ll almost always say like yeah can they sure I would bet against it I would always bet against a trade being finished until it’s finished or you get that rumor it’s like hey this is going to happen we just need to cross the eye I mean cross the teas do the eyes type situation which which we’ll sometimes hear every now and then right um and and a lot of times we’ll we’ll hear that like it’s like waiting on Carson Kelly type thing we we have a feeling that that’s going to get done it’s just uh it’s like okay when’s the official announcement type thing we’re not there yet with Kyle Tucker so I would not just assume it’s done but the feelings it it it has this it has reached a feeling of inevitability which can often lead to disappointment when it doesn’t get if it doesn’t get wrapped up yeah and in Reading Ken’s column in the athletic uh he mentioned Jim Crane the owner of the Astros who was the guy who spiked that Wilson conteras trade to Houston ultimately I don’t think he did it unilaterally but the estos are a little bit of a different organization the Cubs are pretty deliberate uh cautious organization so yeah look we’ve I feel like we’ve covered a lot of this ground here I mean we’re gonna have to think of like those next sorts of stories if it does go down and I feel like we we’ve kind of touched on uh many of those subjects but no doubt like if you go on to social media it feels like you know Marquee should be at the airport when he gets off the plane and then like the C just gonna hand him a lifetime contract as soon as he walks into the office building over there on Waveland I don’t think it’s going to be like that um you know from what we had heard it’s not gonna be some if it does happen it’s not gonna be some sort of like short window to you know talk about extension and so uh yeah you know I have feeling we might wind up recording this then have to record another one uh you know fairly soon thereafter that’s just kind of the nature of these things I thought Jed was interesting saying you know to whenever some information’s out there on any sort of deal about any team he’s always curious like what’s the agenda like why is that out there now and right there are lots of football analogies of being on the you know two yard line you know being in the Red Zone still got to kick the extra yeah just like like it definitely towards the uh you know middle of the week there gets into the you know football metaphors which knows which shows you you know we need need something concrete here right right uh so we’ll see if this gets done I I I think you’re right on the extension stuff don’t get your hopes up on that uh but do do get excited if like I I I said this the last episode I’m going to say it again like don’t overthink this yeah cam Smith would be a heavy price esok bras yeah I know they just creaded for him uh Kyle Tucker is a Difference Maker there’s very few players like that I know there’s only one year left on the deal you got to take risks you got to try and and make your move when you have the opportunity see if he falls in love with Wrigley an extension hey it may be very unlikely that doesn’t mean you make the you don’t make the deal see if he falls in love with the place um and maybe you’re competitive and trying to sign him in free agency maybe you try maybe you can get him early in free agency I don’t know I’m just throwing like you don’t you don’t do this out of like you cannot live in fear especially at this point in in uh in the cycle of contention like it’s time to start being a little bit more aggressive and taking these types of risks if he Go Walks oh well you got to have a pivot plan then um you get a draft pick a nice draft pick and clearly the Cubs have built up some value with these recent picks if Cam Smith is a guy who’s you know being uh or is being talked about out here like that’s you know confirmed but if he’s at that status where he can be that type of uh guy you just got to go back out there and you know keep scouting and find find another one you know like that that had been an issue as we’ve detailed uh for a while now of just the post 2016 like backfilling that group and having assets and having trade chips and having flexibility like this is this is all part of it right right right we’ve talked about that we I talked about that with a lot of different people over this week around the game that it’s a big difference that they’ve seen with the Cubs like they’re in these talks because five six years ago they couldn’t be in these talks because they didn’t have the depth it was like the top top guys like which they got to get like canana and then that’s it and there was nothing else to move they didn’t have those players uh all right Patrick you you wrote something uh for this morning uh on on Justin steel uh the possibility or just the the idea of extending him uh and I think that’s interesting I I think it’s a worthwhile discussion I’m just curious like you uh like why don’t you kind of go over the points for that uh that thought process there well essentially this is not a right now thing uh they’re not engaged at this point typically how this goes you know a player in the arbitration system in January you kind of lock in the salary for the upcoming season or you go to an arbitration trial which you know rarely happens you know with the Cubs or with most teams at this point there kind of a file and trial policy across the league but essentially the idea is you see all these pitching deals I mean Matthew Boyd gets almost 30 million guaranteed a couple months after he was struggled to get Major League offers Max freed just signed the biggest deal ever for a left-handed pitcher and if you look at steel and freed over the last couple years they’re pretty similar now timing is everything for a free agent and steel is not there yet but I think this is something that’s going to make sense for both sides to at least explore and our colleague Tim Brittain at the athletic who’s really an expert at kind of projecting free agent contracts uh extension structures uh he really helped out a ton with this and you can kind of see his work in the athletic it’s it’s interesting uh he uses other relevant comps for pitchers and it’s kind of the idea of buying out the arbitration years what he’s expected to make and then you know attacking on a couple free agent years and so where Tim kind of wound up at was a five-year deal for about 74 million potentially adding one more year would make it a six-year deal for $96 million what do you think sahad okay so five years 75 that’s yeah so that knocks out the three ARB years you’re saying in tax on two yes and and essentially that’s an aav of 15 that’s like right did I do that math right yeah I did um like I think that that for me when you when you put it that way you’re adding two years it would be I believe his age 32 33 Seasons would be the two years I think that would be the preferable deal if I’m in the Cubs seat right I also think you you said it he’s later in free agency right the Cubs have a like and a lot of these situations the player has 90% of the leverage I feel like right if you if you put up like steel doesn’t have like this disastrous injury history yes he has injuries in the past and he’s he’s missed some starts in in some of these years right and like it I’m trying to think like this year it was the fluky hamstring right um that that’s not like a oh no red flag thing right the the the you know popping up of the elbow forearm stuff that is that’s a slight red flag but when everything comes out clean you’re not seeing anything on Imaging for me and I am an optimist so I understand that like you just have to be concerned all the time about any pitcher right whether they have an injury history or not frankly but if they’re they’re they’re taking risks on guys like Matthew boy and paying him almost 15 million a year for two years like yeah yes it would be the money that in those in the age 32 and 33 like the actual money spent would be different but I’m looking at it in luxury tax purposes because that’s all I think you should really look at it as as far as an or goes they it’s not like uh Tom rickets will suddenly go broke in uh whatever that would be 2028 uh so so I think I think when you talk about it in that sense it makes a lot of it makes some sense it’s like who you like you want a veteran at the front of your rotation hopefully I mean the the the way they talk is like there’s no rebuilding going forward it’s contending every year if that’s real if you really believe you can do that you need veterans you need young players I think the question becomes what how what do you believe what what do you believe Jed Hoyer or Carter Hawkins Greg Council all all these people that are intimately involved in this process and and know Justin steel what do you believe how do you believe he’s he’ll age how do you believe um what what type of uh work ethic does he have what type of like what do you see beyond the beyond the person what do you see in his stuff like that says like this AG is well this type of pitcher is the type of pitcher We Believe like early 30s still good still solid and I kind of see him as yeah yeah he’s probably one of those guys that ages well as far as stuff goes it it gets down to injury and what you see is in the person I you know there’s no major red flags with with steel in my opinion on any of that stuff uh you can quibble with anybody’s like oh maybe uh this or that about like the injury stuff uh sure uh but I think it’s worth it when you’re not like that’s a that’s under market value as far as I’m concerned like he hits the open market even at that age I think he gets more than that uh assuming help yeah I mean it’s it’s fascinating like would steel want this I think he’d be interested for sure uh I think just because of his path like you said is unique I mean being with the Cubs for a decade and still having three more RB years to go before reaching free agency like it’s it’s long and to get that sort of security could be attractive I mean if he did reach free agency um healthy think he obviously get a lot more than that right like if he can keep uh performing I I just think it’s one of those things where like you know pitchers get paid even though they’ve been uh downgraded in in terms of letting them just go whatever three four times through the order they don’t put up as many put up as much innings uh but like teams need these guys who can post up and so far Justin steel uh has been that guy uh I think it would be I don’t know would it be a win for this front office to kind of lock up another guy or would it be another sort of like’ done this with Nico and hap and some other guys to where they they are feeling a little bit of a a crunch now not as much um flexibility but I don’t know in the end I think you gota I think both sides it would be in their best interest to try really hard and to see where those potential conversations would go because I mean almost every deal for starting pitcher that’s come in it’s been like oh wow really you know whether it’s the a signing srino I mean valdi definitely did not get the John Lackey you know two years and whatever 17 it was like three for I think 75 uh mat Matthew boy example uh you know Max freed very good pitcher I didn’t think he’d get like the biggest you know beat David Price and you know just kind of demolish what John Lester got roughly a decade ago so this is kind of where where things are going this is more of like something to Monitor and not like breaking news but it’s gonna pop up no doubt yeah some some other quick factors I think that are relevant there’s uh uh like as far as reasons to sign a we don’t know uh we don’t know what Ben Brown Jordan Wicks um Hayden wisneski are it was kind of a I don’t want to call it a Lost season for them but it wasn’t they didn’t get enough information in 2024 to feel really good about their future right Assad you you kind of know what you have there to an extent uh but but there’s it’s not like this they missed out this season on really getting a ton of data on those guys and feeling comfortable that okay you know what we have yes we have all these arms and we trust that that one of them at least is going to turn into a rotation stall work um that it also we don’t know like come March how many of those names I just mentioned will be on the team there are so many trade rumors involving this team like does suddenly the urgency to like you know what we got to lock him up we don’t have the pitching depth the young pitching dep that we thought let’s let’s get a veteran to lock this up uh some of the pitchers have been traded whatever right and then the third thing which we don’t need to get into too far because I think we’re going to be talking about it a lot in a couple years is something I talked to people about like all week it came up in every other conversation is there there’s a potential work stoppage again coming after the 26 Season uh like that’s a real thing that I I think all sides probably consider I don’t know how that impacts talks like this right but um there’s that that’s a reality uh some people were a little bit more optimistic because it won’t take away any games but like inevitably like there’s going to be a work stoppage in the offseason which doesn’t impact fans as much but still is is stressful and and and like gives some uncertainty to what the future holds and and nobody likes to hear stuff like that and and you know it’s not the it’s not the most fun thing to talk about but it it is a reality that that’s coming up and it feels feels sooner than than I realized uh when we started talking about it I was like oh man again uh but that’s that’s yeah that’s very much there and Wan stto contract doesn’t help things when when when the lower bottom 10 payroll teams see stuff like that they those owners only get more fired up about things so we don’t need to dive into that I just wanted to mention like that’s another Factor here yeah I’m not I’m not I’m not ready to go there yet sah yeah uh but I did want to add to your point of like kind of the pitching uncertainty uh the Cubs will have a decision on showa in minaga after this upcoming season uh I don’t have all the numbers in front of me we’ve written about it uh on the athletic but essentially like if shoda has a decent season and is healthy uh at the end of it the CBS will basically have to decide on you know picking up essentially like a three-year option or then become signific with a jump in money right or keeping the four deal that he has in place but but he can become a yes he could he could opt out if they don’t pick up their option and yeah and so him opting out would be a pretty obvious decision if he’s healthy and isn’t terrible uh this upcoming year of course C you know both s they could come to some sort of other agreement um but like shodo was locked in as his piece and he was awesome as a rookie but like very quickly uh both sides are going to have to figure out where they want to go from there so if you put in steel as a piece I mean Ty’s halfway through his four-year deal um you know Assad is a younger guy and then it’s that kind of wave of question mark pitchers who could be really good or maybe we won’t hear much from them ever again yep no absolutely uh and another pitcher uh that that we’re going to be talking about for about a month now if not a little bit longer uh Roki Sasaki the Cubs are in on this right I mean I think the prohibitive favorites are the Dodgers um you know depending on who you talk to uh they’re the heavy favorites others you know say watch out for San Diego um but I I guess don’t eliminate the Cubs just yet that’s actually a good good way to put it that uh my understanding is the Cubs will be presented as a viable destination and a serious team to consider I mean that doesn’t I don’t know how much that moves the needle ultimately but it was fascinating being in Dallas and talking to different officials as well as our talented co-workers at the athletic who hear things as well and just kind of comparing notes on this guy like is this all an elaborate cover story for before he signs with the Dodgers or are these very telling hints about what the player ultimately may want uh which may not be all of Dodger Stadium which is a lot um right so like is San Diego uh and kind of riding shotgun with Darvish a more appealing option uh I think Joel Wolf the agent uses the phrase open-ended and that is kind of my understanding as well like if he’s planning to take a Christmas break back home in Japan uh they don’t want to overload him with zooms they’re gonna want to space some things out I know everyone wants to be like these are the five teams and they are usually the same five teams over and over again for elite Japanese players but like you know teams could enter the picture um you know as much as saki’s Representatives know him like there’s still a lot for him to figure out too like he’s younger he is more of a developmental pitcher than Yamamoto was um and each player is different you know we I like I am guilty of this myself of kind of lumping all Japanese players as like the same sort of entity but you he obviously has his own own backstory here and has a lot to learn um still think he winds up on the west coast ultimately that would probably be a good bet but like you know both New York teams you know figure to be factors in here are gonna W to um kind of tell their stories but you know the Cubs are firmly in that group of teams that um Elite Japanese players have to consider and there’s a very small group of agencies that kind of represent these players and uh wman in particular has a good working relationship with the Cubs and right I think that that stuff does go a long way in this process it may not get you the player but it gets you kind of in the room or on the zoom uh in the conversation with these guys right yeah and I think it the Cubs seem pretty good at this part the pitching the player part you know like they they’ve I I feel like that’s a strength of theirs obviously they were able to lure uh shoda uh seya they um I know seya seya still uh brings up the the weather uh stuff you li to me so cold here in a joking manner he’s but but it’s a I think funny they they somehow finished second in um in the in the Shi uh race when when he first came and and ended up going to the angels supposedly they were second right and that like that was something where they had no I think they like that was even a surprise that they they were that far up uh in the contenders so they they have a good uh they’ve done a really good job uh establishing themselves as a destination for Japanese players uh it’s something that was a focus of Jed Hoyer um he’s he’s really emphasized that there’s a lot of talent coming stat side and and it’s important to establish a base it’s important to make the these players feel comfortable uh to feel at home as best as they can uh because it can really impact your team and like uh this is a global sport now and and you want to be able to get Talent from all wherever you can uh and and it it was a smart move to establish that as early as they could right they didn’t have the built-in advantage of being on the west coast and uh to be able to do that um to do that in Chicago when you don’t have a coast I think is is important I think that they’ve uh Lake Michigan Lake yeah yeah so we’ll see where that goes I so I think it’s important to note that this isn’t going to happen like the official signing he’s not signing until after Janu uary 15 15th yes 15th is the date which means everybody’s in on it like everybody’s um IFA money uh resets on that date now there is the little weird wrinkle of like a lot of that money’s been promised so yeah we’ll see but um my assumption is uh you know these things have a way of working themselves out so if if you end up winning the Roki saki sweep Stakes you don’t say I already promised it to this 15-year-old the Dominican Republic uh that’s a whole other disastrous issue there but uh yeah so we’ll see where where this goes I I think rok’s a a fascinating arm uh injuries aside like if he can get healthy and in the right system and develop properly that’s that’s very exciting that’s going to be exciting for whichever fan base uh he ends up playing for um all right Patrick I I think that’s that’s about it we’ve uh we’re going to be be on the alert here for the next 24 48 hours I think um just uh behind the scenes for the fans uh Dansby Swanson signed when I was at a holiday party that holiday party is Saturday uh and if if I have to do this again Patrick I’m not sure we’ll be able to do a live podcast just so you know uh all right I I got you I got I got you peover don’t don’t worry about that both if it happens it better be in the in the morning okay that’s all say all right well I’m sure they’re definitely looping in your social calendar as they make these deliberations like they got to clear with the Astros owner and kind of your uh holiday party yes exactly circuit please please help me out here thanks so much for listening everyone make sure to Great review And subscribe to norside territory please subscribe to the athletic where Patrick and I are on top of all things comes this winter and uh yeah thank you so much for listening all this is uh North Side territory

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